[Bo9S] Stone Power + Steely Resolve: Legal?

[Victim]

Besides, stances aren't random. Iron Guard's Glare is pretty much always going to be available.

 

[Wrathamon]

There is a crusader in my game and I say it make it more interesting to play with the randomness then having them when you want them.

It is a nice balance.

Curious I donthave the book handy but my player's crusader does the stone power steely resolve damage sponge thang and I am not sure he is only doing it on normal and stone dragon manuevers. I think he may also be doing it with devoted spirit. Where does it state this so I can look it up and show him?

thanks

 

[Kurotowa]

Page 32-33 of ToB, the first sentence of the feat's Benefit description. "When you use an attack action or full attack action, or you initiate a Stone Dragon strike in melee combat, you can take a penalty of as much as -5 on your attack rolls."

 

[SteveC]

Facinating! ...but doesn't the "randomness" of the crusader's maneuvers get in the way?

Well yes and no: the Shield Block is a maneuver so I don't always have it available, but Iron Guard's Glare is a stance, so I can have it up all the time. I almost always have it running, since my other stance gives +2 to Will Saves and +4 versus fear to my allies (we're running in an almost all undead game, so fear has been pretty common, and I expect vampiric charm to be coming soon).

So the GM hasn't been making me tell him which maneuvers I have ready, so he doesn't always know what I can do at any given time. Once I use the Shield Block, he knows he can have a round or two to hit at my allies afterwards, but in one case I reset all of my abilities immediately after I used it, and drew it randomly again.

As a result, I've gotten a fair bit of milage out of the combination, and have been keeping our Greenbond and Rogue out of trouble. Heck, I draw attacks away from the Paladin, who really makes the most out of them.

I am only playing at modest levels, and I know that the White Raven manuevers will get better over time (maybe too good), but I have to say that the Crusader has been very useful so far, but not overpowering. All of my strikes are based on a normal attack roll, and low level characters miss a lot. Add to that the fact that I use Stone Power a lot, and managed to pick up a negative level fighting a wight, and there you go. Still, I'm having a blast with the character.

--Steve

 

[BASHMAN]

The solution is simple-- the DM has to out damage your stone power and steely resolve. All it takes is more than 10 damage a round to do this.

From what I understand, stone power lasts until the begining of your next turn, and steely resolve lasts till the end of your current turn, yes?

So from what I understand this is how it works, using a 2nd level crusader with 20hp:

Initiative order:

Ogre
Crusader
Cleric
Orcs


Ogre crushes the crusader for 12 damage, 5 of which go into his delayed damage pool, 7 of which comes off his HP.

On his turn, the Crusader activates Stone Power, gaining 4 temporary HP, but taking -2 to hit, raising him back up to 17 hp. The crusader attacks and hits because of the +1 furious counterstrike just countered some of his -2 from Stone Power). At the end of his turn, the crusader takes the 5 damage from his pool, lowering his hp to 12.

The Cleric Heals the crusader, curing 7HP, bringing him up to 19 hp.

Orcs attack the crusader, doing 8 damage to him, lowering him to 4hp.

Round 2

Ogre attacks the crusader and hits for 9 damage, 5 going to his delayed damage pool, lowering him to 0HP.

Crusader spends his action to recover a maneuver, and thanks to a feat, gains 6hp, raising him to 6.

Cleric heals the crusader 7hp, rasing him to 13.

Orcs attack the crusader again for 8 damage, crusader down to 5 hp.

Round 3
Ogre hits crusader for 10 damage, taking him to -5.

Crusader rolls to stabalize and fails, lowering to -6.

Cleric heals crusader for 7, bringing him up to 1hp.

Orcs attack cleric for 8 dmg.

Round 3
Ogre hits crusader for 12 dmg, killing him.

Cleric tactically withdraws

Orcs charge after, doing 8 dmg

etc.

Essentially, the DMs problem is either he isn't hitting you, or not hitting you hard enough. As I see it, that feat only slows down death--- it does not prevent it, unless you have 1 opponent only hitting you for less damage than the stone power gives you per round.

 

[SteveC]

The solution is simple-- the DM has to out damage your stone power and steely resolve. All it takes is more than 10 damage a round to do this.

From what I understand, stone power lasts until the begining of your next turn, and steely resolve lasts till the end of your current turn, yes?

The basic idea is right, but you have some of the math wrong. None of these abilities prevents death, they just delay it for a few more rounds. In a low level game (we're only 3rd level, knocking on the door to 4th) those two or three extra rounds really matter. Basically, if the Crusader and his party don't kill the ogre by about round 3, the combat is likely to be going south.

The thing you left out is that the Steely Resolve occurs each round, so that you're delaying 5 HP damage each round until the end of your turn, so you can really choose when to use the Stone Power ability. If I go a round and don't end up being hit, for example, I don't use Stone Power and don't take the penalty to hit.

The thing the Crusader did in your example that really hurt him was to take the round to recover maneuvers and heal himself. When you're in a fight like this, you have a very few rounds to take your opponents down. What I would do (and did do in the combat I was in when I ended up taking 15 HP in one turn), assuming of course that I had the maneuver available at the time, is use Crusader's Strike in a round where I took a huge amount of damage. That's a strike that lets you heal 1D6+class level with a successful strike. It's also not compatable with Stone Power, so there's a tradeoff there: if you miss, you get nothing, and you don't even have the temporary HP to work with.

You're right, however, that these feats just extend the time you have in combat, they don't make you invulnerable or anything. In the example I used, I was taking a lot of attacks that did low damage, and needed a high roll to hit. The group managed to win the fight (I certainly didn't win it alone) but we came out of it much less beat up because the other characters (we have a Paladin, a Greenbond and a Rogue...no Wizards...ack...) were able to do their jobs effectively without being mobbed.

--Steve

 

[Krafen]

Also, keep in mind Crusaders cannot spend a round to recover manuevers. Their maneuvers recover automatically, although with a random element.

 

[RigaMortus2]

Also, keep in mind Crusaders cannot spend a round to recover manuevers. Their maneuvers recover automatically, although with a random element.

Well, if they have Adaptive Style they can spend a full-round action to Ready new maneuvers, which then become "immediately available" to them. So it will cost them a feat, but they can do it.

Also, to mitigate the damage he is taken, I assume the Crusader DID take the healing strikes, right? That is like a must for Crusaders