Bo9S

[Shadeydm]

I have seen posts on both sides of the fence regarding how balanced the Tome of Battle is or isn't. I have noticed that a majority of the those who think the martial Adepts are balanced just fine tend to be playing one ot playing along side one. This got me thinking and left me with this question.

If you were a player in a game where Martial Adepts started appearing with regularity as adversaries yet the PCs were not allowed access to those classes or feats etc would you still think everything was fine and balanced?

 

[Nifft]

As adversaries, who cares? Adversaries last for like 10 rounds at most. It's giving the PCs powers they can use all day which gives some people the heebie-jeebies.

Cheers, -- N

 

[theredrobedwizard]

I've recently began replacing the Alertness feat on all Goblinoid creatures with Martial Study. This has improved their potency a bit, as well as making them much more memorable. No PC has levels in a martial adept class, but not for lack of me trying to persuade them to take levels.

In fact, I'm actually going through RHoD and replacing all the Fighters with Warblades and the Clerics with Crusaders. I'll let you know how it goes.

-TRRW

 

[Asmor]

I'd dislike that (NPCs being martial adepts while PCs couldn't be) just because I have issues with fairness and balance.

That said, I wouldn't mind playing against martial adept NPCs (assuming of course the option was there for me to play as one, regardless of whether I chose to or not).

 

[Arkhandus]

I have seen posts on both sides of the fence regarding how balanced the Tome of Battle is or isn't. I have noticed that a majority of the those who think the martial Adepts are balanced just fine tend to be playing one ot playing along side one. This got me thinking and left me with this question.

If you were a player in a game where Martial Adepts started appearing with regularity as adversaries yet the PCs were not allowed access to those classes or feats etc would you still think everything was fine and balanced?

Yes. And I don't see how it's relevant. I'm fine with facing enemy Sorcerers who can hurl a half-dozen Fireballs at me all in a row while their annoying minions keep me from closing in on the Sorcerers. Martial adepts aren't that kind of deadly.

And I've played alongside a martial adept at low levels (1-4), and he didn't overshadow the rest of the party. Certainly didn't overshadow the orc barbarian.

 

[Irda Ranger]

If you were a player in a game where Martial Adepts started appearing with regularity as adversaries yet the PCs were not allowed access to those classes or feats etc would you still think everything was fine and balanced?

I am such a player is such a campaign. My feeling is that this is a dumb question. I have no idea what the CR is for a given opponent (nor do I care), so I have no idea whether or not it's "fine and balanced." Was that guy we fought really tough? Hell yeah. But since the GM can be using a CR 8 or a CR 12, I have can't say whether it's balanced or not.

Arkhandus' point about the half-orc barbarian is useful information though.

 

[Nifft]

One side note: if your DM is using multiple Crusaders against you, he's more of a man than I am. Or at least more organized.

Keeping track of the options for ONE of those dudes tests my attention span to the limit. Between delayed damage pool and random recovery, they are high maintenance.

Cheers, -- N

 

[theredrobedwizard]

... he's more of a man than I am. Or at least more organized...

Yay! I'm more of a man than Nifft! My life is now complete, and I can leap to my death knowing full well that I've bested the best at something.

-TRRW

 

[Shadeydm]

Well my purpose for asking this "dumb question" as you so kindly describe it as follows. If these classes are truely balanced then there should be no issue of the game described in the question being fair and balanced should there. Yet already fairness and balance has been called into question.

I would also like to add that I find it intersting how many of you react as if I have put down the material in question which I have not. In fact I have been teetering on the edge of buying this product for a while now. Therefore I am always interested in as many opinions on the product as I can get, and as many different perspectives as possible.

 

[TwinBahamut]

I think people would question the fairness and balance of things, regardless of whether they are balanced or not. It is a new system that is quite different from what came before, treading into the realm of older classes, and it works great. It works so great that it forces some to consider whether the status quo of classes was balanced. Of course people are going to ask whether it is balanced, the way people still argue about the balance of the PHB classes. It doesn't mean there is much to find.

In my current Eberron game, I am playing a Warblade, and so far, my most abusive and unbalanced actions have involved a mistake over the power of flasks of oil. The duskblade in the party is probably stronger in the short battles of that campaign, and the party psion is easily comparable to my character. The last major member of the party isn't even designed as a combat character, so I don't think he minds if I am stronger than him.

Overall, I just think it is a good book. Trust me, 1-on-1 duels between Martial Adepts are more interesting than between two fighters, and the classes are very fun to play, but they are not terribly overpowering.