Buffy series finale (spoilers)

[John Crichton]

I thought it was a fitting end to the series. It wasn't the ending to end all endings, but I enjoyed every second of it. I loved the subtle references to the series' beginnings, the return of Angel and Buffy's (to me) Cookie Dough speech was a great bookend to her relationship with him and to being a Slayer in general.

The D&D/Trogdor scene had me in stitches. The gathering of the Big 4 near the end was great. I wish they hadn't showed the White Willow moment in the teasers because that was a powerful scene; I enjoyed it anyway. The battle which I thought was going to be a little flat, actually blew me away. Buffy getting up from a sword to the back worked for me. She's been through worse and still kept fighting.

I had little problems with the episode, but I chalk it up to a season that wasn't Season 2 or 3. There were a few (for Buffy) dud episodes in there and it seemed like the second half of the season was walking waist-deep through mud. Had the follow-up been stronger, I have a feeling that people wouldn't have such issues with the finale.

Honestly, I was on my feet for the last 10 minutes. I didn't need complete closure on this show because I like the characters to keep living on in my mind. Plus, there have been talks about feature films and more spinoffs and the like.

I look back on the last 7 years that Team Joss has given us with Buffy and I just smile. The highs were much more numerous than the lows and I will seriously miss this show. They ended it at the right time. Not perfect, but a fitting end.

Salute!

 

[Wayside]

2) There are now *hundreds* or possibly *thousands* of Slayers running around? Whoa, wait a minute! Faith was a Slayer, and she went rogue. How many of these Slayers will go rogue without a Watcher? How is this going to affect continuity on Angel? (Although I never understood why Jasmine's presence wasn't experienced in Sunnydale - at least not that I saw).

I don't think so. While eventually there should be a lot of slayers, the First took care of most of them before Will did her thing. Aside from those that survived the big fight, there shouldn't be more than a handful left around the world. Ones that Bringers never found.

I liked the episode overall. I was somehow under the impression that it was going to be a 2 hour finale, so that was disappointing. Spike's exit was great, wish there was more focus on it. Mostly there was no resolution, which I hate, but I'm also glad it happened that way. Buffy's story isn't over. She just saved the world. Again.

Hopefully there will be at least one movie, and they'll spend a LOT of time getting the script perfect.

 

[Chun-tzu]

A lot of the little things can be ignored. Say we forgive character inconsistencies, and the multiple deus ex machinas. There are still at least 3 important plot points from earlier in the season that were never resolved:

1. Dawn's conversation with her mom (or the First). "Joyce" was clearly foreshadowing something, and talked about Buffy being against Dawn, and "not choosing" her.

2. You know, we never really found out what the First's PLAN was. It supposedly had reasons that it didn't want to just kill Buffy, her friends, and the potentials. It had plans of some kind for Spike.

3. What was the thing about an anomaly? I think it was something the First had alluded to, but I'm not sure. There was a lot of speculation, like that it referred to Buffy's (second) return from the grave, or the simultaneous existence of two Slayers, or Dawn.

I'm just curious as to what the heck happened to all these things. Were they making it all up as they went along? (I doubt it.) If not, and they had plans, why were they dropped?

Could someone please explain this Trogdor reference? I have no idea what he/she/it is.

It’s a reference to this Flash animation:

http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail58.html

This website, Homestar Runner, is a favorite among many EN Worlders, at least.

Originally posted by Wayside
Buffy's story isn't over. She just saved the world. Again.

But from a character perspective, this event was much more. Buffy is no longer "The One." This means that she is free to live a normal life, without all the pressure to save the world and fight demons because she is the only one who can (except for Angel, of course). I think it makes for a much better ending than killing her off or removing her powers.

 

[zyzzyr]

I don't think so. While eventually there should be a lot of slayers, the First took care of most of them before Will did her thing. Aside from those that survived the big fight, there shouldn't be more than a handful left around the world. Ones that Bringers never found.

Hmm, I hadn't really thought of it that way. Two catches, though: they did show at least 3 or 4 non-characters (NPCs?) who obviously became Slayers. Even if you assume a few others (maybe 20 in total?) and it's still way more than can be handled by one world.

1. Dawn's conversation with her mom (or the First). "Joyce" was clearly foreshadowing something, and talked about Buffy being against Dawn, and "not choosing" her.

2. You know, we never really found out what the First's PLAN was. It supposedly had reasons that it didn't want to just kill Buffy, her friends, and the potentials. It had plans of some kind for Spike.

3. What was the thing about an anomaly? I think it was something the First had alluded to, but I'm not sure. There was a lot of speculation, like that it referred to Buffy's (second) return from the grave, or the simultaneous existence of two Slayers, or Dawn.

1. I believe that it is possible, unconfirmed, that "Joyce" was really the First, trying to sow discord. I don't believe that - I think likely that it meant she chose Spike as champion over Dawn ... ?

2. See "alternate script" stuff below.

3. I had thought that the "break in the Slayer line" which is being referred to was that the existence of TWO Slayers meant that evil had to be upped to balance good and evil: hence, the First comes back. Now that the First is gone, and there are many Slayers ... Good is overweighing big-time.

My own points ...

What is this "alternate script" floating out on the web? (search for trogdor + buffy on google, it will come up). I assume it is a false script that Joss leaked to throw people off the trail, or possibly one of the "fake" scripts written to keep the ending in suspense?

If there are elements of truth in it, then you can read it to get some resolution to other things ...

1) The First tries to sing to Spike during the battle. Spike says "I don't like that song no more," and the First's plan is foiled. Spike actually *hits* the First (but the First actually hits Buffy before this).

2) Dawn tries to take the amulet from Spike, believing that she should be the champion - Buffy chose Spike over Dawn.

3) Xander dies. Anya lives.

4) A hand comes out of the rubble of the school at the end of the show.

5) The First appears as Joyce during the battle. The First appears as the Caleb/Master/Glory/the Mayor/Angel during Buffy and the First's basement chat.

6) Buffy gives some sort of speech as to Dawn/Faith/Buffy being all joined together somehow, and that all three would need to die before a new Slayer is called.

Can be seen here ...

http://www.buffy.nu/article.php3?id_article=731

If it IS real, and I assume it is - it came out before it aired - then I assume that Joss wrote those things down to "resolve" the "discrepancies" for the fans who care enough to read it.

 

[Vocenoctum]

here's what I posted to Nutkinland while EN was dead;
They never explained what the anomaly was.

They never actually defeated the First.
(If you had to spill blood to release an Uberdemon, why weren't they sacrificing a lot more people. Why didn't he work to free them? If the Uber's were not important, what's the entire point?)

They spent the entire season with episodes that dragged with no advancement, then the final episode is rushed?

The guy that chopped Anya did it with a nice torso splitting, why did the Uber that stabbed Buffy use a wussy little stomach poke?

Another guy I know complained because they never explained why The First didn't simply blow up the Summer's house a lot sooner.

So, all those at the end getting imbued all over the world, they were all Proto-slayers? The line was never in danger?

Probably the funniest episode of the season, the Angel/ Spike stuff was great, the D&D game was hilarious. The battle sucked, and the show ended on it's typical "girl power" vibe. At least the guys got to do something besides stand for male oppresion this time. icon_smile.gif

This season was one big plot hole; the sycthe, the old lady in the temple that never existed, Caleb getting into that temple and going unnoticed, the anomaly that weakened the slayer line...

Oh, and when they skipped over the proposal to use it for drama later, we were all wondering if they'd finally decided to pull the "drown the slayer, revive her, drown the next slayer, revive her" thing icon_smile.gif

Willow using more Ubermagic really just left a bad taste. Might as well have made Willow a Slayer too, why the hell not!

 

[Wayside]

2. You know, we never really found out what the First's PLAN was. It supposedly had reasons that it didn't want to just kill Buffy, her friends, and the potentials. It had plans of some kind for Spike.

Well, the First's plans for Spike were spoiled several episodes before the finale. Remember, when Wood tried to kill him? As for wanting to kill Buffy and the potentials, I think things had to be done in a certain order, otherwise the First couldn't capitalize on the newfound vulnerability of the Slayer line.

3. What was the thing about an anomaly? I think it was something the First had alluded to, but I'm not sure. There was a lot of speculation, like that it referred to Buffy's (second) return from the grave, or the simultaneous existence of two Slayers, or Dawn.

Well, given the ending, I think we can pretty much say now that it was the existence of multiple Slayers.. though considering the fact that there have been two since the end of Season 1, it's odd the First was just then showing up with the big bad plan. Still, assuming that the First (since the end of Season 1) was killing off potentials all over, it's earlier appearance (where it tried to turn Angel and then kill him) sort of makes more sense, even though Spike ended up being the champion, not Angel.

Anyway, the vulnerability of the Slayer line was fixed (or overwritten, anyway) when Willow activated all the potentials. It certainly could have been made clearer (and I wouldn't have minded them explaining the mechanics of it all), but to wrap everything up they really needed a 2 hour finale, which they should have had. Damnit.

But from a character perspective, this event was much more. Buffy is no longer "The One." This means that she is free to live a normal life, without all the pressure to save the world and fight demons because she is the only one who can (except for Angel, of course). I think it makes for a much better ending than killing her off or removing her powers.

From a character perspective Buffy is The One, always was The One and will always be The One. She is the focus of the story. The series is named for her. There are other Slayers now, but none are anywhere near her in terms of power. She isn't just going to kick back and have a Corona now that there are more, just like having Faith around didn't change much.

In terms of the Slayer line Buffy hadn't been 'The Slayer' since she died the first time and Kendra was called. But she has always been The One.

 

[MattyHelms]

RE: Spike and the amulet

If I remember correctly, one of the main reasons Wolfram & Hart were after Angel was because of a prophecy that a vampire with a soul would stand with the Slayer as a Champion and close the Hellmouth. The vampire's reward? To become human. I don't think Angel knew this when he gave the amulet he received from the retreating Wolfram and Hart. This is from a few seasons ago on Angel, so I don't think it will be cheap for Spike to return.

Later,
Matt

 

[WizarDru]

It’s a reference to this Flash animation:

http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail58.html

This website, Homestar Runner, is a favorite among many EN Worlders, at least.

"I say, come on fhqwhgads, come on fhqwhgads. Everybody to the limit, the Cheat is to limit, everybody come on fhqwhgads!"

 

[WayneLigon]

....the First took care of most of them before Will did her thing. Aside from those that survived the big fight, there shouldn't be more than a handful left around the world. Ones that Bringers never found.

This is my theory, and my observations; I have NOT watched any other episodes this season. In fact, the only ones I've seen are the ones on DVD.

The implication is, I think, that there are a LOT of them now, more than enough to foil the ultimate plans of The First. And that it was always meant to be this way; not one per generation, but an army of Good to oppose the army of Evil. The Watchers, effectively, short-circuited the entire process and - perhaps even knowingly - brought about the current state of crisis.

What she said was that everyone of all the women on Earth - with the potential to be a Slayer now is one; I'd think that would be a fair number, given the number of potentials they found just with their resources.

 

[Gargoyle]

I watched the series faithfully through episodes 1-3, but work and other things kept me away. Recently I started to catch up on the reruns. I realized how much I love the characters and their development, even in the less than stellar episodes and seasons.

The D&D scene had us howling with laughter, so maybe that's why I missed the Trogdor quote (Somebody post it if you can remember). I liked the idea of Willow's spell, and Spike's sacrifice (and his usual wit). The Angel cameo was pretty disappointing though, we wanted to see him fighting alongside Buffy _and_ Spike at the end.

I never watched enough episodes to figure out the whole plot of the final season, just a few, but even I could tell the plot of the last season was pretty weak. Like many others, I really enjoyed the final conversations between the four before the last battle. Brought me right back to the end of episode 1.

Darn good series. I'm glad it's on DVD.