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D&D 5E Can a hasted bladesinger cast a cantrip with the haste extra action

ECMO3

Explorer
I know haste can normally only be used for the attack action "one weapon attack only" but when a bladesinger 6th level or higher "..... whenever you take the Attack action on your turn ... you can cast one of your cantrips in place of one of those attacks."

So can she take the haste weapon attack and then promptly cast a cantrip "in place of" the attack?
 

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I also go with - No.

The Haste limitation on the Attack action ('one weapon attack only') overrides the Bladesinger ability to spam a cantrip in place of an attack with the Attack action, because the Bladesinger ability relies on you using Extra attack as part of that action (which the Haste extra Attack action precludes you from doing).
 


Nefermandias

Adventurer
The RAW is no.
That said, I do have an issue with the fact that this isn't nearly as clear as it should be, like many other things in 5e.
Natural language, man.
 



NotAYakk

Legend
The kind of wording in the rules that let you replace a single attack with 2 via extra attack, or a single attack with a grab, are the same wording that let you replace an attack with a cantrip.

Haste, as most people read it, prevent the one-attack-for-two or hasted-grab use of the attack action, so should also block the cantrip casting.

Now, there is a perfectly valid alternative reading. In this reading, Haste prevents just prevents a 2nd weapon attack with that action. Anything you do with that action, so long as it causes no more than 1 weapon attack, is allowed.

Under that reading, a hasted attack action on a barbarian could be a weapon attack and a shove, or a weapon attack and a grapple.

And a bladesinger could make a weapon attack, then substitute her second attack with a non-weapon attack cantrip.

Or, they could replace one attack with a cantrip that involves a weapon attack, and substitute their second attack with a grapple or shove.

Basically, does haste say that you can do any attack action, so long as it is no more than one weapon attack, or does it say that the only thing you can do with the haste action is is an attack action, and in that attack action you can do nothing but a single weapon attack? Under the second wording, arguably you wouldn't even be allowed to smite, as an attack action with a weapon attack and a smite isn't only one weapon attack.

Honestly,. there is an entire spectrum of how strict you can read the haste action attack.
 



doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
I know haste can normally only be used for the attack action "one weapon attack only" but when a bladesinger 6th level or higher "..... whenever you take the Attack action on your turn ... you can cast one of your cantrips in place of one of those attacks."

So can she take the haste weapon attack and then promptly cast a cantrip "in place of" the attack?
Absolutely. Haste allows you to take the attack action, and limits you to one attack. Bladesingers can replace an attack made as part of the attack action with a cantrip. That’s it.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
No. The "one weapon attack only" restriction clearly means that the attack action from haste can only be used for making a single weapon attack and not anything else you could otherwise do with an attack action.
It very clearly doesn’t say that. The spell let’s you take the attack action, but limits it to one weapon attack. Bladesingers can replace an attack made as part of the attack action with a cantrip. That’s it.
 

Lycurgon

Explorer
Absolutely. Haste allows you to take the attack action, and limits you to one attack. Bladesingers can replace an attack made as part of the attack action with a cantrip. That’s it.
I disagree. There is more to it than that. The Bladesinger's Extra Attack feature lets them attack twice with the Attack Action on their turn. Then it says "Moreover, you can cast one of your cantrips in place of one of those attacks."
So with the Haste Action you cannot use the Extra Attack feature. Because you can't use the first part of the feature there is no way to use the second part. "... in place of one of those attacks" is impossible because you don't have "those attacks" granted by Extra Attack.
 

There is one thing that is entirely clear: the wording of Haste is ambiguous. It could mean that the granted Attack action can only be used to make a weapon attack. It could mean that if you use the Attack action to make a weapon attack you can only attack once. Both are equally valid interpretations of the language used. It's DMs call.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
There is one thing that is entirely clear: the wording of Haste is ambiguous. It could mean that the granted Attack action can only be used to make a weapon attack. It could mean that if you use the Attack action to make a weapon attack you can only attack once. Both are equally valid interpretations of the language used. It's DMs call.
Seeing as the Attack Action only allows weapon attacks, what's the difference?
 



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