Can a Slowed Creature Shift?

[Xeterog]

many monsters have powers that say something like "Shift X squares and make an attack (or attacks)" Which would not be affected by slow (IMO, most should be shift their speed, but it's not in most cases).

 

[Infiniti2000]

This. You may move more than your speed by using a power that says so. There's a clarifying errata that explicitly says this too, by the way:

You cannot benefit from bonuses to speed,
although you can use powers and take actions, such
as the run action, that allow you to move farther
than your speed.​

But, isn't run a bonus to speed? This errata statement conflicts with itself. Run says "speed +2", which is a bonus to speed. So, no, your general statement that you may move more than your speed is wrong. For example, if a power says you can move your speed +2, then you can still move only your speed unless you use a run action.

Right?

 

[Stumblewyk]

But, isn't run a bonus to speed? This errata statement conflicts with itself. Run says "speed +2", which is a bonus to speed. So, no, your general statement that you may move more than your speed is wrong. For example, if a power says you can move your speed +2, then you can still move only your speed unless you use a run action.

Right?

Note that the rule description of Run doesn't say you receive a +2 bonus to speed. It says your movement is now Speed+2. I think that's the important and crucial difference.

 

[DracoSuave]

But, isn't run a bonus to speed? This errata statement conflicts with itself. Run says "speed +2", which is a bonus to speed. So, no, your general statement that you may move more than your speed is wrong. For example, if a power says you can move your speed +2, then you can still move only your speed unless you use a run action.

Right?

What?

Your speed is an explicit value, set for you by your race. Dwarves have speed 5, most races have speed 6, some have 7, and this can be altered by armor and features and what not.

So, look at that entry on your character sheet that says speed. Now, imagine it is 5. Your character uses a power that says 'shift 6.' How many squares do you shift?

6. Obviously. Because your speed isn't called into question. Your speed is not relevant to that form of movement.

So, let's try this again. Imagine that number is now... 2. Your character uses a power that says 'shift 6'. How many squares do you shift?

6. Because, as above, your speed is irrelevant to the power.

Now let's say you have a power or action that tells you to move your speed + 2. And, let's say your speed is.... 2! Well, 2 + 2 = 4. So you'd move 4.


When you are slowed, your speed is now 2. Other things are not made 2. Your powers do not have numbers changed on them to 2. The ONLY thing that changes when slowed is that one thing on your character sheet that says 'speed.' Only powers, effects, and actions that ask for your speed care about slowed, and if it tells you to add something to your speed, that gets added onto that 2 because that's how numbers work.

 

[webrunner]

One thing to add to everyone (or rather, to combine everyone
there is a difference between:
"Move your Speed +2"
and
"Move with a +2 bonus to Speed"
or
"Move, considering your speed to be 2 more"
or some such.

"Slow" is stacked after all speed changes. so any situation where you say:
"Move (your Speed)"
that is affected by Slow.

Normally you replace "speed" with your speed. Sometimes you replace speed with some other number depending on the power ("move with a +2 bonus to speed") since it's considering speed itself to be two greater. But if the speed value is seperate from the other things (such as the +2 to run) you get that.

All in all, Slow is really not that useful against monsters.. not only are they usually already in melee past first round, if not they have awesome basic attacks (so they can just move+ charge you for 4 spaces)

If Slow also said "you may not charge", then it would be much more useful..

 

[keterys]

I suspect it'd be an interesting house rule to have slow remove the ability to shift.

I do wish an awful lot of monsters, like ones with flyby attack, would specify 'speed' instead of a flat number. 'Yay, I slowed the dragon' 'Okay, it flies 14 squares and attacks this person here' 'Err, but its speed is 2' 'Yeah, but it just says move 14 and attack at any point'. Boo.

Then again, I'd be okay with the same for players too. But, whatever, I'm okay mostly ignoring slow as a condition too.

 

[Jack99]

I think the slow rule is one of the dumbest of 4e, so it's has therefore been house-rules since.. well actually before 4e came out...

IMC, slowed means slowed. You can't run, you can't move more than 2 in any way shape or form. Has worked well so far.

But yeah, RAW, you can shift (almost) all you want, even if slowed.

 

[Obryn]

I would guess that this would be the bodily function most-affected by Slowing, but I don't know why you're trying to defecate in the middle of combat in the first place.

-O

 

[Oldtimer]

I suspect it'd be an interesting house rule to have slow remove the ability to shift.

In my house-ruled 4E, the slowed condition also disallows shift, charge and run. Works extremely well and makes it very useful.

 

[Infiniti2000]

What?

My apologies. Obviously, my post wasn't clear about what my point was because your response had nothing to do with it (I don't think). My comment was purely on the bonuses to speed. A power that allows you to shift 6 has nothing whatsoever to do with it. So, let's compare a power that let's you move (however you want to define this) your speed +2 with the errata. The errata says "You cannot benefit from bonuses to speed." So, therefore the bonus doesn't apply. However, you can run, which applies a bonus to speed. I see that as a contradiction.

Now, before you ask, I see the statement "although you can use powers ... that allow you to move farther than your speed" provide for your point. I.e. "you can shift 6." But, if the power said, "you can shift your speed +4" then no, I would say the +4 is disallowed.

It's really a badly worded errata one way or another. Either, they didn't intend this conflict and therefore worded it wrong. Or, they intended it and didn't make it clear as a bell or provide reasoning. Even then, it also means that the way in which you word a power likely has significantly different (and likely unintended) impacts on certain conditions such as slow.