can bards use wands?

[MerakSpielman]

We don’t consider it a loophole, and from looking at the 3.5 SRD I believe it was meant to be that way.

Perhaps you're right, but it still seems like a loophole in my mind. You can grab your 4th level paladin a few wands and it's like he gained some class abilities several levels early.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Perhaps you're right, but it still seems like a loophole in my mind. You can grab your 4th level paladin a few wands and it's like he gained some class abilities several levels early.

Huh?

Like a 3rd level sorcerer with a scroll of Fireball?

-Hyp.

 

[Trainz]

Perhaps you're right, but it still seems like a loophole in my mind. You can grab your 4th level paladin a few wands and it's like he gained some class abilities several levels early.

Hur... the wand still costs 750 g.p.. At 1st and 2nd level, that's the whole party fund. But I feel it's almost an obligatory investment.

In our game, when we were 1st level (we're now 4th and 5th), a wand of CLW was our prime objective. As soon as we had 750 g.p. (which incidently was at 2nd level) we commissioned a church to build a CLW wand, even if one of the PC's is a druid. From then on, we kept regularly buying CLW wands. And it's the RANGER who mostly uses them on himself and party members.

We currently have two and a half (about 120 charges), and we feel much better when we tackle a dungeon.

The DM doesn't feel we're exploiting any "loopholes"...

 

[MerakSpielman]

No, I mean like a 2nd level paladin with a wand of Cure Light Wounds. A paladin can't normally cast that spell until level 6th level (assume a Wis of 10).

Wands of Cure Light are relatively cheap. They only cost 750gp, since they're a first level spell. Then the paladin can cast 50 shots of a spell he won't otherwise be able to cast until 6th level.

A wizard can cast Fireballs at 6th level, and a wand of fireballs costs 11,250gp. A first or second level wizard will never be able to afford that.

If you have no problem giving a 1st level paladin the ability to do things he can normally do at 6th level for 750gp, why not let the wizard have some 6th level abilities for the same price?

 

[Hypersmurf]

No, I mean like a 2nd level paladin with a wand of Cure Light Wounds. A paladin can't normally cast that spell until level 6th level (assume a Wis of 10).

Forget 6th level.

Even if you house rule that wand activation is tied to caster level, a Paladin or Ranger gets a caster level at 4th, regardless of Wisdom.

And they're 1st level spells. The impact on the game isn't the same as a 3rd level spell. Spellcasting is a very minor part of a Ranger or Paladin.

Giving a 2nd level wizard a wand of fireballs isn't like giving a Paladin a Wand of Cure Light Wounds; it's more like giving him a Longsword of Speed. At 6th level, the Paladin gains an iterative attack - that's closer to his primary focus than 1st level spells.

-Hyp.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

If you have no problem giving a 1st level paladin the ability to do things he can normally do at 6th level for 750gp, why not let the wizard have some 6th level abilities for the same price?

It is only so cheap (750gp) because the game mechanics rate it a low level power in the context of the game as a whole.

This "loophole" significantly benefits paladins, rangers, bards, and sorcerors. And wizards and clerics. In short, that is exactly how wands are designed to work. There are no mechanical restrictions against a 1st level wizard using a Wand of Fireballs, nor are there restrictions against a 1st level paladin using a Wand of CLW.

BTW, a 1st or 2nd level paladin is unlikely to be able to own a wand of CLW because a focus requires expensive equipment. So we are talking about 3rd level paladins here.

All of that aside, the real reason I would allow it is because paladins would be so drastically inferior to fighter/clerics if you start nickel and diming them.

 

[ciaran00]

Perhaps you're right, but it still seems like a loophole in my mind. You can grab your 4th level paladin a few wands and it's like he gained some class abilities several levels early.

Where are you "grabbing" all these items from? DM's out smoking or what?

ciaran

 

[Darklone]

IMC, it's about availability. And given the choice of two masterwork weapons or one wand of Cure Light wounds, my average group would take the weapons. Because they
a) like to avoid damage due to tactical superiority
b) they like to have their own healing power.

 

[Kahuna Burger]

If you have no problem giving a 1st level paladin the ability to do things he can normally do at 6th level for 750gp, why not let the wizard have some 6th level abilities for the same price?

I think the big disconect might be that you are looking at the Paladin, while others (though it hasn't been said explicitly) are looking at the Party. CLW is a 4th-6th level ability for the paladin, but its a 1st level resource for the average party. If the party doesn't have a cleric or even a druid, having the party spend 750 gold and use one of the less exploited abilities of their paladin (who will be skipping out on some damage dealing in addition) is a perfectly reasonable way to get that standard party resource. Fireball on the other hand is not a resource normally available to ANY 1st level party, and is therefore quite reasonably more expensive.

I think a few people have even explicitly mentioned buying the wand out of party funds... there's no balance issue.

Kahuna Burger