D&D 5E Can I use action surge in the middle of another action (between attacks when attacking with extra attack)?

[FrogReaver]

It doesn't. The Action Surge rule says you can use it on your turn. Specific rules allow it on the turn, but without the bonus action timing exception.

so why doesn’t this objection work?

It says I can use it on my turn. Therefore I can use it before/after my action.

Objection - there is no rule giving you permission to use it before/after your action and therefore it’s not RAW to do so.

 

[Maxperson]

so why doesn’t this objection work?

It says I can use it on my turn. Therefore I can use it before/after my action.

1(action) + 1(additional action) = 2. 1(additional action) + 1(action) = 2. I'm not the one arguing that it has to be after. It can be before or after as far as I can see.

Objection - there is no rule giving you permission to use it before/after your action and therefore it’s not RAW to do so.

The rule says you can use in on your turn, therefore you have explicit permission to do so. You do not have the timing exception that bonus actions have, though. To deny use is to negate the rule that you can use it on your turn. You would have to make a house rule to prevent the use of the ability.

 

[FrogReaver]

1(action) + 1(additional action) = 2. 1(additional action) + 1(action) = 2. I'm not the one arguing that it has to be after. It can be before or after as far as I can see.

that’s not the point of my words. There are 3 places on your turn you could use action surge. Before your action, during your action or after your action.

Your objections are only about using during your action - but the logic can be just as easily applied to deny use before or after your action as well. That’s the logical issue.

The rule says you can use in on your turn, therefore you have explicit permission to do so. You do not have the timing exception that bonus actions have, though. To deny use is to negate the rule that you can use it on your turn. You would have to make a house rule to prevent the use of the ability.

Exactly. Now apply this to on your turn during another action.

 

[Maxperson]

that’s not the point of my words. There are 3 places on your turn you could use action surge. Before your action, during your action or after your action.

Your objections are only about using during your action - but the logic can be just as easily applied to deny use before or after your action as well.

No it can't, because specific beats general. The specific ability allows use on the fighter's turn. My logic pertains ONLY to what is not written at all. If nothing in RAW allows or disallows something, then the default state is no unless you house rule. Action Surge is something RAW allows, so my logic has nothing to do with it.

 

[Irlo]

Even if it is, it's still not relevant. Ultimately you cannot interrupt an action without a house rule that says you can, so a house rule has to be made either way.

Hmm. That it’s an inference is completely relevant. It is in fact my point. Reading and interpreting RAW requires inference. There’s little meaning without it.

This doesn’t feel like we’re having a conversation, so I’ll be stepping away.

 

[FrogReaver]

No it can't, because specific beats general. The specific ability allows use on the fighter's turn. My logic pertains ONLY to what is not written at all. If nothing in RAW allows or disallows something, then the default state is no unless you house rule. Action Surge is something RAW allows, so my logic has nothing to do with it.

So If RAW allows something then the default state is yes unless you houserule?

 

[FrogReaver]

In case it wasn’t clear to everyone, I’ve changed my mind on this topic.

 

[Maxperson]

So If RAW allows something then the default state is yes unless you houserule?

Yes, if RAW explicitly allows something. RAW says you can be an elf, so absent a house rule saying no elves, players can pick elf as a race. RAW says yes you get a +3 bonus for a 16 strength, so absent a house rule saying something different, you get that.

There is no RAW that says you can interrupt an action, and no RAW saying you can't, so the default is that you can't unless the DM makes a rule that you can. This is a necessary default state, because there are a incredibly large numbers of things that RAW doesn't specifically approve of or deny, such as farting out nuclear missiles. If the rules are silent on something, the DM has to make a rule saying yes or no, assuming it comes up in game of course. If it never comes up, no rule is necessary.

 

[FrogReaver]

Yes, if RAW explicitly allows something. RAW says you can be an elf, so absent a house rule saying no elves, players can pick elf as a race. RAW says yes you get a +3 bonus for a 16 strength, so absent a house rule saying something different, you get that.

There is no RAW that says you can interrupt an action, and no RAW saying you can't, so the default is that you can't unless the DM makes a rule that you can. This is a necessary default state, because there are an incredibly large numbers of things that RAW doesn't specifically approve of or deny, such as farting out nuclear missiles. If the rules are silent on something, the DM has to make a rule saying yes or no, assuming it comes up in game of course. If it never comes up, no rule is necessary.

The rules explicitly say you can use action surge on your turn. So using action surge on your turn is allowed.

 

[Maxperson]

The rules explicitly say you can use action surge on your turn. So using action surge on your turn is allowed.

Yes, but it doesn't explicitly have the exception written in that Bonus Action does, so it does not have that exception that allows it to be used DURING an action.

RAW disallows moving during your attack action. You move either before OR after it, even though you can move on your turn. The game then writes in a specific exception if you have extra attacks.