Can you convert 3.5 DnD Characters to hero system Characters

[Elf Witch]

Are any of your spells in a Variable Power Pool or Multipower?

Here's why: with those, you dump a bunch of points into them, and each individual power only costs a few points into them. The Limitations on the VPP or MP apply to the big point dump AND the slots.

So...just going from memory, you'd have a VPP or MP with limitations like Gestures, Components, can't be cast while wearing armor, etc. Since your PC is Vancian, you'd have the Limitation "Can only change spell slots after 8 hour rest" and "Can only change spell slots with spell book (Obvious, inaccessible focus)." Memorization should be limited by slots per day per spell level, just like D&D- remember, though, that your slots won't automatically be linked to your stats. Together, that should make for a sizeable power base for not a bunch of points.

The points in the base VPP would determine the maximum power of any spell within it. Break your spells up by level by limiting the maximum active points. Say...5 for cantrips, 15 for 1st level spells, going up 10 -15 points per spell level after that.

All that applies to the wizard spells- make a similar VPP or MP for the Dread Necromancer spells, but without the limitation on changing the slots, since you can cast any one of those freely.

Adding spells to the spellbook might require a skill check.

Scribe Scroll would be another VPP, built much the same way, but with the additional limitation that it can only be a spell you know.

Strength in HERO isn't important for a caster...I'd probably keep that score unaltered from the 10STR base. And 62 points on stats seems a bit high in a 120 pt campaign.

Take combat skill levels- only works with your VPP- to boost your accuracy and/or damage.

Off the top of my head, I don't remember how I'd do Familiars.

I will have to look on how he did the spells I got a little lost when he was describing it all while we were doing it. I have the books and I understand more than I did before last night so I will try smd figure it out. I will ask about some of the suggestions like spell book as a limitation.

I wanted to keep my strength at a 10 but he insisted that made my character too weak and ineffective. I do see an issue here, First of all his Hero games have all been superheroes he has never run a fantasy Hero game. When he used to run fantasy he used Ad&D. Secondly he personally has never played mages he likes to play what he calls strength bricks. He also has this view that we are above average of the general population which is why he wanted high stats but conversely he does not want a high powered game as he put it no Superman or Ironman.

He wanted to do familiars as a sidekick with a combo as a power focus so that eventually I could cast spells through it. I didn't have enough points and he told me that I would not get the benefits I would get in DnD like emphatic then later telepathic link or have it talk to creatures of its kind and my protection spells ,which I have none at this time, would not be shared with my familiar. So I am wondering if it is really worth the points to spend on it. It would be cheaper to take train animal and have a pet which is his suggestion. Though familiars have human intelligence.

I am confused about how disadds work. Why do the players all have to an equal amount in total points? I don't like this way of doing it at all. Unless the disadds don't really effect anything. In Shadowrun you take disadds to get more points some players end up with more but those disadds can be a real liability at times. Especially if the DM uses them which ours did. I don't see how my disadd of being hunted to the extreme and their goal is to enslave or kill me and they have a 50/50 chance of showing up is equal to having a code of honor in points.

To be honest this has just confirmed my belief that converting characters is so not worth it. I have hated it almost every time we have done it when we went from first to second to third in Shadowrun I refused to go to fourth I was ready to yank my hair out. When we went from Ad&d to 3E was equally bad. The only painless one was 3 to 3.5 because the DM said we didn't have to convert if we liked the build we had but any new characters would have to be 3.5. I think it is better to wrap up the campaign and start a new one.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Disads add build points to a PC, but at the cost of giving your PC campaign or character based appropriate downsides. They sort of balance a benefit with a downside, just like in Shadowrun. However, you don't HAVE to take Disads up to the campaign limit. By not doing so, you do sacrifice power...but you have fewer downsides.

Typically, most GMs won't check ALL of EACH PC's conditional Disads- like Hunteds- every time. That would result in someone's Hunters showing up nearly every encounter. Instead, they'll choose a point at which a plot complication might make sense, and check for the ones that make the most sense. If one triggers, they stop. That's why a high value conditional Disad like Hunted will be valued the same as something like a Code Against Killing which applies 100% of the time. Especially in a campaign in which killing foes is the norm.

I understand why your GM gave you the 75 point limit he did, since that kind of goes with the general "Heroic" level of a campaign- the level at which a typical Fantasy HERO campaign might start. However, you're not starting a Fantasy HERO campaign with starting PCs, you're starting one with converted experienced PCs.

Personally, I'd have started the converted campaign at 100 base points* with somewhere between a 120-150 point limit with Disads. That higher base would reflect the PCs' experience: since HERO characters gain XP (which are also build points) as they advance, that higher base would reflect the experience level of the converted PCs.








* in some early HERO material, you'll see NPCs with the same base points as the characters plus "build points" plus Disads to reflect experience. In later works, they typically just rolled that experience into a bigger base point limit.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

It occurs to me that the limitation "Can't be used while in armor" for arcane spellcasting reflects more of a pre-3Ed type formulation. In 3.X, armor wearing isn't an absolute guarantee of arcane spell failure, but rather, a something that gets checked with a roll.

To reflect that difference, modify the ASF limitation to "Requires a skill roll to use when wearing armor."

 

[Elf Witch]

I made the decision that I don't want to try and convert this character. There is just to many changes that effect the story so far. Story consistency is important to me. I support him switching to Hero I do think it is a better fit for his game. I wrote him this and I also explained that if he didn't let me switch I didn't want to continue to play. We are at a perfect place to let my character go off and bring in a new one.

I am thinking of some kind of rogue swashbuckler type character.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Fair enough!

For maximum combat "swashbuckleryness", make sure you get your hands on the Ultimate Martial Artist book. In HERO, "martial arts" are a collection of maneuvers, which you buy for 2-6 points each. You then buy them with (as I recall) the 1 point option of "usable with weapons", so you can do your fancy moves either armed or unarmed. And, of course, Combat Skill Levels.

You can do all of that with the list in the basic book, but the UMA expands the list of maneuvers by 3x or so.

 

[Elf Witch]

Fair enough!

For maximum combat "swashbuckleryness", make sure you get your hands on the Ultimate Martial Artist book. In HERO, "martial arts" are a collection of maneuvers, which you buy for 2-6 points each. You then buy them with (as I recall) the 1 point option of "usable with weapons", so you can do your fancy moves either armed or unarmed. And, of course, Combat Skill Levels.

You can do all of that with the list in the basic book, but the UMA expands the list of maneuvers by 3x or so.

I think I may have a PDF copy of it I will have to look. I really need to organize my PDFS and make a master list.

I like swashbucklers but hated playing them in DnD. I am using that as part of the argument to let me switch. I am a little tired of playing mages. I think Hero might support it better.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

As a swashbuckler, you'll be able to use...

One of my favorite things in HERO for low-power campaigns or supers without the flash powers is the good ole "Trenchcoat Multipower"- a bunch of cheap but useful gear (sunglasses, binoculars, flashlights, cellphones, handcuffs, etc.) that can fit into the pockets of a (Kevlar-lined) trenchcoat.

See also John Constantine from various DC Comics Vertigo line titles, Tom Baker era Dr. Who and Jerry Steiner from Parker Lewis Can't Lose.

With a swashbuckler, one of the great schools- immortalized in popular media- used a weighted half cape as a weapon: blinding or tripping a foe, entangling a weapon, enhancing feints, etc.

Perfect for a low-power MP.

 

[DrunkonDuty]

Sorry to hear that you will have to ditch your character concept there, Elfwitch. Mages can be difficult in HERO. A lot comes down to how the GM wants to model the magic system.

Nice suggestion re. the cape fighting, Dannyalcatraz. It's a classic.

I second the Ultimate Martial Artist as a great source but if you can't find it consider Combat Skill Levels as a good alternative way to model a martial art. Heck, even if you do find it, consider Combat Skill Levels.

The way I'd do it using just skill levels is to buy a bunch (6-8 of them) of Combat Skill Levels for use with a "tight group of manoeuvres." (Cost is, IIRC, 3pts/level.) Define that group as "Fencing" or maybe "cape and blade fencing" or some such. (Discuss with your GM what they think qualifies as a "tight group." Keep in mind that generally this means a whole Martial Art - be it Fencing or Kung-fu or Ninjutsu - OR a Multi-power.) Now, with your bunch of skill levels on any given action you can move them around to be defensive, offensive, for damage OR some combination thereof. Your character will have great flexibility.

Skill Levels are the bomb. Also, as you go up in XP you can upgrade your existing skill levels, turning 3-pt skill levels (that are only for use with your Fencing or what have you) into, say, 5-pt skill levels that can be used for all Hand to Hand Combat. Then later upgrade to 8-pt ones (ALL combat) and even 10-pt ones (ALL Combat and all Skill and all Stat rolls.)

Please note that it takes 4 skill levels to add 1 level of damage (1 "Damage Class" or "DC" in HERO speak) to a Killing Attack. It only takes 2 Skill levels to add 1 DC to a non-killing attack ("Normal Attack" in HERO speak.) Note that things like Disarming your opponent or Entangling their weapon count as Normal Attacks for damage purposes, even if you use your rapier to do it. Also note that a weapon, now matter what your combination of strength, skill and what have you, can only ever do 2x it's base Damage Classes. e.g. A rapier has a base damage of (IIRC) 1d6 Killing damage (this is 3 Damage Classes, Killing.) It it will never be able to do more than 6 Damage Classes, that is 2d6 Killing.

Best of luck Elfwitch. And please do feel free to ask advice on character design, it's one of my favourite parts of the game.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

FWIW, I ran a classic martial arts campaign with a "Bloodsport" tournament in it many years ago, and one of the matches pitted a blind old martial arts master against a bruiser (who cheated by using hidden "back-alley" cesti). Awesome fight! The old master bobbed and weaved, landing blow after blow against the slab of humanity (?) that opposed him, while avoiding every last strike by the evil gargantuan.

...except for one really huge one that damn near decapitated him. Fight over.*

I bring it up because, not only was it a cool, classic matchup, but because it illustrates the kind of combat you can have in a heroic level HERO game...especially when you're playing a dexterous warrior going up against bruisers.


* The old blind master would have won had he not followed the rules- like his foe- and used his staff during the match.

 

[Elf Witch]

Thanks for the input and I may be back for help. I am very impressed with the Hero system. Yes character creation is rather long but I am used to Shadowrun which is also long. I may look into getting a character generator to help.

And I do believe the game is more suited to this than DnD any edition.