Casting spells without actually, you know, casting spells.

[Jeph]

I'm thinking of allowing non-spellcasting characters to be able to cast spells in my game.

Er, let me rephrase that: I'm considering creating a highly expensive option for characters not having levels in a spellcasting class, but possessing great knowledge of magical theory, who wish to cast spells. It would revolve around a high Knowledge (Arcana) roll along with some hefty expenditures in time, money, and personal energy (exp).

Right now, what I'm considering is this:

• To cast a spell, you must have at least two more ranks in Knowledge (Arcana) than twice the spell's level, and must have a deciphered scroll or other magical text detailing how to cast the spell on hand. If you use a scroll, it is not used up in the casting. Your effective caster level is your rank in Knowledge (Arcana) minus three.

• Casting the spell requires a Knowledge (Arcana) check with a DC of 20 plus twice the spell's level and takes one hour plus ten minutes per spell level or the spell's standard casting time, whichever is higher. Any number of assistants that also meet the minimum rank requirements may use the Aid Another action to help you cast the spell.

• On top of any componants that the spell requires to cast, you must spend 100 exp and material componants worth 100 gp per level of the spell, or 50 exp and 50 gp for a 0 level spell. If the caster has assistants, each assistant must expend 10 exp per spell level (or 5 exp for a level 0 spell).

• If the Knowledge (Arcana) check to cast the spell fails, the caster wastes the alloted time and loses half the requisite exp (as do any assistants), but suffers no other penalties and may continue in their attempt to cast the spell by again spending the required amount of time and making another check. If any check fails by 5 or more, the caster and their assistants waste all the time and resources put into the effort. In addition, the caster takes 1d6 points of damage per spell level. Any assistants take 1 point of damage per die.

Opinions? Thoughts on balance?

Thanks,
--Jeff

 

[Cheiromancer]

Maybe they should use Knowledge (Religion) to cast Cleric spells, and Knowledge (Nature) to cast Druid spells.

There should be a bonus for a caster of the appropriate type attempting the spell. A sorcerer using a wizard's spell book to cast a spell he doesn't know. Easier, cheaper, or both, I don't know.

Ability damage (a la Call of Cthulhu, or BoVD/BXD) may be a suitable cost. I'm not too sure I'm crazy about xp expenditures. I don't like to track the xp of my NPCs, and I bet it is the NPCs who would be using this technique most often.

What kind of spells do you see as being especially suitable to be cast in this way?

 

[Gez]

I've a house-rule system (see on page 2), where there's a Magical Might score that works a bit like the BAB.

Every class gets one, except that non-spellcasting classes progress slowly.

For non-spellcasters, I would allow a feat to get access to level 0 spells in one kind of magic, and then, taking the feat again for level 1, then level 2, etc.

Since for non-spellcasters, the MM progress at 1/4 the level, it means that every four levels, they climb up one level on the wizard's spell per day table. I.e., at level 4, they get to cast 1st-level spells, at level 12, they are able to cast 2nd-level spells, and at level 20, 3rd-level spells. This costed them four feats, and 6 points in a spellcraft skill.

Now the thing becomes more complicated when you picture in the fact there are several level of complexity, and to get access to complex or exotic spells of a level, you'll need more feats. Besides, there are four types of magic.

 

[Staffan]

I would recommend using Spellcraft rather than Knowledge (Arcana). Spellcraft is the knowledge of magic itself, while Knowledge (Arcana) is all the stuff around it.

To make a modern-day analogy, Spellcraft would be the equivalent of Play Sports - the skill you use to actually hit the ball, skate around the rink, outfeint the other guy, whatever. Knowledge (Arcana) would be the equivalent of Knowledge (Sports) - who won the third quarterfinals in the World Cup of 1954, who played goalie for a certain team in a certain match, etc.

 

[Jeph]

Hmm...perhaps Knowledge (Arcana, Religion, or Nature) to be able to cast the spell in the first place, and Spellcraft for the actual roll?

I see this as being used for spells with long term effects, mostly--sort of pointless to spend an hour and a half and years of your life for a Fireball or Gust of Wind. The various Planar Binding and Planar Ally dwoemers, along with a few warding spells, should be the most common effects.

Thanks for the interest.
--Jeff

 

[Stormborn]

Urban Arcana for d20 Modern has a system of Incantaitons which can allow non-spellcasters to cast certain spells. Appropriate for big ceremonial magics, and it is a d20 system that already exists.

To take it the other way: Establish the "rules" of magic such as sympathies etc. (take a look at SJGames Authenic Thaumaturgy by Issac Bonewitz for such things, or Unknown Armies versionof Thaumaturgy) and let nonspellcasters use those rules to cast certain kinds of spells. I think that the methods already discussed will work fine as long as it costs in time, effort, materials, and skill points and is adequately supported by roleplaying. In which case it probablly won't be unbalancing, and a group on noncasters assembling the needed knowledge and materials could make for a facinating campaing in and of itself.

 

[Gez]

Note that if you make such a system, actual spellcasters would be able to use it too. It can be of interest when spell slots are exhausted (or if the spell isn't on their list).

 

[Stormborn]

Note that if you make such a system, actual spellcasters would be able to use it too. It can be of interest when spell slots are exhausted (or if the spell isn't on their list).

That depends. Its easy to say that divine spellcasters couldn't, due to some taboo. Of course if you do that then divine spell casters can never take a class that allows access to arcane spells, unless of course they serve a god of magic or something.

I imagine most spellcasters would not want to use a system that took longer or was more difficult unless they had to. Easier just to go to sleep and do it tomorrow.

 

[Gez]

I imagine most spellcasters would not want to use a system that took longer or was more difficult unless they had to.

Everything is in the "unless they had to" -- as I said, if time is of the essence and they have no more spell slots; or if the spell is not of their list and no one can cast it but themselves (like, you're a sorcerer, your buddy wizard is dead, and he was the only one with the Planeshift spell to leave the cursed demiplane where you have been sent to whatever reason); or for any other reason that may creep in.

It would be weird that a barbarian would be able to cast, even at great efforts, a spell from a grimoire; but not a sorcerer or a cleric -- or even a wizard who don't have the 10 days and 1000000 gold to copy that damn spell on his own spellbook...