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Castles & Crusades

Slit518

Explorer
I like collecting TTRPGs, and I came across Castles & Crusades a while back. It must of been one of the older editions because it was still in black & white.

From what I understand is it takes 2nd edition D&D and makes it a bit smoother? And if I am not mistaken this is a game Gygax helped design after TSR or WotC or whomever gained the rights to D&D when he lost them?

I have also heard that Castles & Crusades is all the same game between the different prints, it is just certain errata fixes and slight rule tweaks.

Overall, for those of you who have played it, how is Castles & Crusades as a game? They're on their 7th print now, right?
 

mach1.9pants

Adventurer
I like collecting TTRPGs, and I came across Castles & Crusades a while back. It must of been one of the older editions because it was still in black & white.

From what I understand is it takes 2nd edition D&D and makes it a bit smoother? And if I am not mistaken this is a game Gygax helped design after TSR or WotC or whomever gained the rights to D&D when he lost them?

I have also heard that Castles & Crusades is all the same game between the different prints, it is just certain errata fixes and slight rule tweaks.

Overall, for those of you who have played it, how is Castles & Crusades as a game? They're on their 7th print now, right?
Yup 5th Edition onwards (2012) was coloured

It was the first, as far as I know, OSR game - in that it took modern rules and applied old school style to it. OSRIC was the first retro-clone (trying to make 1E alve again) but C&C was the first to use 3E ideas and the OGL to tidy up 1/2E DnD.

I think you are mistaken, Gygax didn't write C&C (you can check out Dangerous Journeys and Lejendary (sic) Adventures if you want) though he did work with Castle Zagyg & other stuff with Troll Lord Games. He was working with the company when C&C came out, so he may have had some input, not credited input tho

AFAIK the prints aren't that different after 4th print, but they are there. More info: https://www.trolllord.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=15036

7th is newest, I like CnC as a 'smoother' OS style DnD, the Primes System is contentious and a lot of people mod it in someway. Otherwise they make some reall good stuff, especially their sourcebooks like Codex Celtarum etc.

From Wikipedia "The Siege Engine works on an attribute check system. A character's attributes are divided into primary and secondary attributes. Checks made against primary attributes have a base Challenge Base (or target number; abbreviated "CB") of 12, while secondary attributes have a CB of 18. The game's referee, the Castle Keeper, adds a challenge level (usually from 1-10, depending on task difficulty) to the CB and the resulting number, the challenge class or CC, is the final target number required to succeed at a check. The player adds the character's level, any attribute bonuses and class bonuses to the roll of a twenty-sided die. If the result after bonuses equals or exceeds the challenge class, the player succeeds.[8] Except for combat, the Siege Engine is used for anything that requires a check in the game.[1]

While the first two printings of the Players Handbook were virtually identical with the exception of a change in font for the headers, the third printing introduced a replacement barbarian class. The 4th printing introduced an expansion to the illusionist written by James M. Ward that allowed the illusionist to heal others. The current printing introduces a streamlined replacement to the game's encumbrance rules for faster play." Not sure what it means there by 'current printing'?

there are also a lot of threads about it, have a google!
 
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aramis erak

Explorer
C&C is the second or third OS game using modernized rules that I encountered... and I have the whitebox C&C.

The rules are not Gygax's - Gygax wrote a setting for C&C, Castle Zagag

2E based? No. 1E with a few 2E elements.
Class List: Fighter, Ranger, Rogue, Assassin, Barbarian, Monk, Wizard, Illusionist, Cleric, Druid, Knight, Paladin, Bard.

Note that Knight is the AD&D 1E Cavalier. 2E has no assassin, illusionist is "specialist wizard," Barbarian is a kit, not a class, Cavalier is a kit, not a class.

As for smoothing? It's a two mechanic system... the attack roll process, and the saving throw process, with boolean proficiency... it doesn't scream smoothed over 2E so much as Simplified 3E with AD&D 1E classes.

Never got it to table. It's definitely able to use AD&D (either) modules with no major changes.
 

Retreater

Explorer
I bought into the first hardcover printing and white box when they were released in the early 2000s. I ran a couple games of it, and it was a nice, rules-lite experience with a classic D&D feel. It provided a simpler, more traditional playstyle when compared to 3.5/PF and 4e D&D. However, now I wonder what role it fills against the streamlined D&D 5e. Basically, anything you could do with C&C, you can do with 5e. Unless you're already a fan of the system who's purchased splats, adventures, etc., I see no reason to invest in it today. Which is sad, because I generally like the art, and the Trolls all seem like cool guys. It just doesn't stand out in ways that other OSR products do (Forbidden Lands, DCC, S&W, etc.)
 

Flexor the Mighty!

18/100 Strength!
Yeah its a 1e/3e mashup in a way. Its saves tied to each ability kind of bled into 3e with the primes kind of being your proficiency saves. Its a good game and I ran a campaign but I switched over to Swords and Wizardry since its even simpler and runs like lightning.

I would heartily recommend it though.
 

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