Challenges for NPCs to gain XP

[Quasqueton]

The concept of how do NPCs earn xp if they are not out adventuring prompted me to post thread.

Take a farmer in a small village. What is a CR1 challenge he could overcome for experience points?

A town magistrate. What is a CR3 challenge he could overcome for experience points?

A king's advisor. What is a CR 8 challenge he could overcome for experience points?

Quasqueton

 

[Crothian]

stuff....truthfully, it doesn't matter you just assume they are gaining XP and eventually gaining levels. The game isn't about the NPCs so I don't bother worrying exacltly what they do to gain levels. They just do, and its off screen.

 

[Quasqueton]

Repeat after me: "imagination exercise".

Quasqueton

 

[ThirdWizard]

Really, anything where a character expends resources and entails some kind of success/failure could be considered valid for a Challenge Rating. Meaning the possibility of dying outright isn't a hard and fast requirement for gaining XP. So the farmer convincing the landowner to let him stay and work on his farm (diplomacy so he can feed his family) could have a CR associated with it.

So a CR 1 challenge for a farmer could be bluffing his way out of taxes. (bluff check, success is not paying full taxes, penalty is being beaten and them taking more money)

A CR 3 challenge for a magistrate could be in convincing other city officials to prosecute an offender who has backing by a thieve's guild. (dimplomacy check, success is getting them to press charges, failure is having them rat you out to the guild)

A CR 8 challenge for an advisor could be in sneaking after the prince who is meeting with an assassin and learning about his plans to assassinate his father. (hide & move silently checks with listen checks, success is finding out the plot, failure is probably being killed by the assassin)

So NPCs rely much more on skill checks for their XP the way I see it. Much like a rogue using Search/Disable Device to overcome a trap's CR. This relfects their non-combatitive nature.

 

[Silveras]

For a CR 1 challenge to a farmer, just getting things planted on time could be an appropriate challenge. If the horse pulled up lame (assuming there is even a horse), plowing could be made extra difficult this year.

A CR 3 challenge for a town magistrate might be getting a witness to appear safely at a trial, or convincing a lynch mob to leave the accused in prison for trial.

A CR 8 challenge for a royal advisor is getting more into PC territory than NPC, I think. However, a suitable challenge might be arranging that all the weapons used by the royal army come through a specific merchant house. Another could be persuading the stubborn king to listen to the people instead of to the courtiers.

Are you looking at this from the perspective of Sean K. Reynolds' article on NPC XP earnings? He suggested that, for levels 1-10, NPCs could reasonably be expected to face one CR-appropriate challenge per month, and that they would thus earn 1 level per year, so a Level 7 Expert would likely be 7 years older than the starting age for that race.
Article

 

[smootrk]

For important NPCs, I just level them up ad-hoc to keep them in line with the PC's. For less important NPCs, I don't bother to level them, unless it seems appropriate. It just does not mean alot to improve them if they never have much impact on the campaign.

Then again, I don't bother to stat un-important npc's until absolutely necessary (when they become important).

 

[painandgreed]

stuff....truthfully, it doesn't matter you just assume they are gaining XP and eventually gaining levels. The game isn't about the NPCs so I don't bother worrying exacltly what they do to gain levels. They just do, and its off screen.

I emphatically disagree. NPCs are the only yardstick that the players have by which to judge themselves. If the players find themselves always lower level than the town NPCs then the game becomes futile. If the NPCs never advance then suspension of disbelief has issues because you wonder how that guard could get to 3rd level by 21 yet never gain another level in the 12 years that the PCs have been based in the town. If they advance at the same rate as the PCs, then why are the PCs bothering to adventure instead of doing what the townspeople are doing? How does a DM decide how to advance NPCs so that the PCs can judge themselves? He sits down and figures out the details.

 

[Silveras]

I emphatically disagree. NPCs are the only yardstick that the players have by which to judge themselves. If the players find themselves always lower level than the town NPCs then the game becomes futile. If the NPCs never advance then suspension of disbelief has issues because you wonder how that guard could get to 3rd level by 21 yet never gain another level in the 12 years that the PCs have been based in the town. If they advance at the same rate as the PCs, then why are the PCs bothering to adventure instead of doing what the townspeople are doing? How does a DM decide how to advance NPCs so that the PCs can judge themselves? He sits down and figures out the details.

While I partially agree, I feel I should point out that what you describe is only one style of play.

Many others play more "pick-up" oriented games, where the Guards in town never become more than Guard 1, Guard 2, and Guard 3. The players in such games only ask "is this the same guard as last week?" if they have a plan to use a "yes" as a means of getting something out of the encounter, or if they suspect that the guard in question is part of the adventure and no longer just "a guard".

 

[IronWolf]

I emphatically disagree. NPCs are the only yardstick that the players have by which to judge themselves. If the players find themselves always lower level than the town NPCs then the game becomes futile. If the NPCs never advance then suspension of disbelief has issues because you wonder how that guard could get to 3rd level by 21 yet never gain another level in the 12 years that the PCs have been based in the town. If they advance at the same rate as the PCs, then why are the PCs bothering to adventure instead of doing what the townspeople are doing? How does a DM decide how to advance NPCs so that the PCs can judge themselves? He sits down and figures out the details.

He never really said his NPCs do or don't keep pace with the PCs. Just that if he felt they needed to advance then they did. If it was relevant as to how they advanced I am sure there is a reason at hand.

NPC advancement is up to the DM's discretion. In my games some advance faster than the party, some the same pace and others slower. It all depends on the NPC and their role in the campaign. I certainly don't need the exact details for each of their advancements. I might for some, but far from all.

 

[jmucchiello]

I emphatically disagree. NPCs are the only yardstick that the players have by which to judge themselves.

How do the players find out what level the downtime NPCs are? The original question was about farmers. How often do the players interact with a farmer to the point they can find out his BAB?