D&D 5E Changing How Wizards Use Cantrips

[Cap'n Kobold]

What do people think? Is there any issue or balance concern that I haven't considered with this mechanic? Any foreseeable problems to be prepared for? Has anyone ever tried this?

I can see it causing some issues in games at the higher tiers of play.
Most games don't seem to reach the sweet spot for balance of 6-8 encounters per day, so at higher levels, wizards very rarely have to rely on cantrips.
At this point, many wizards would jump at the chance to have a wider range of spells available to them, and the cost of losing access to some cantrips is a minor one for them.

 

[Wiseblood]

The problem I see is. “Why would I use my resources to prepare 4 or 5 cantrips when I only use 1 or 2?” I would just have more space to prepare higher level spells.

Yeah, they become more versatile just not in the cantrip area.

 

[Charlaquin]

I would like it better if it weren't also adding to the spells prepared by also adding proficiency bonus to spells prepped. That marginalizes the choice part because it's nothing but net gain in versatility overall. I find it more likely a wizard will prep a lot of cantrips at low levels when they have no slots and few cantrips at higher levels when they have a lot of slots to increase the already nice chunk of spells available.

Leave the number of spells prepped as is then change cantrips from known to scribed and prepped and I really like the idea that way.

My thoughts exactly. The idea of Wizards adding cantrips to their spellbook and preparing them daily just like they do with other spells is great. But I wouldn’t want to cross-pollinate cantrips prepared with spells prepared. Just leave spell prep exactly as-is, change the “cantrips known” column on their table to “cantrips prepared,” and give them maybe six cantrips in their spellbook to start with.

 

[Ashrym]

@Hawk Diesel The problem with your concept makes assumptions on the number of cantrips a wizard would actually prepare. I'm not saying you don't know this, but here is a reminder on what cantrips are for anyone who might not be aware.

Cantrips are spells that spell casters learn and know as part of learning to cast spells.

A cantrip is a spell that can be cast at will, without using a spell slot and without being prepared in advance. Repeated practice has fixed the spell in the caster’s mind and infused the caster with the magic needed to produce the effect over and over. A cantrip’s spell level is 0.

At 1st level, you know three cantrips of your choice from the wizard spell list. You learn additional wizard cantrips of your choice at higher levels, as shown in the Cantrips Known column of the Wizard table.

That's why they are not in the spell book in the first place.

The other reason they are not in the spell book is 5e does use a variation on AED as shown in the by short rest / long rest recovery abilities. Not all classes follow the same AED schedule and it's not exactly the same but it's still a thing. Cantrips are given as an at-will ability and measured against other classes in at-will / always on options. That is where your assumption on number of cantrips being prepped matters.

In early levels a Wizard should have access to one less cantrip, but by level 20 will have access to one more cantrip (assuming they choose to memorize a number of cantrips equal to their proficiency bonus), so for me this seems to equal out.

That's not true. If I only have 2 spell slots anyway I would prep mage armor and sleep, 4 cantrips for the at-will options when I have no spell slots, and carry 2 or 3 rituals. The extra cantrip is the benefit for playing a sorcerer but your proposal enables the wizard to replicate it and carry rituals and carry that broader spell list.

Low levels don't last long. But when I have a lot of slots to carry me through the day then I'm not going to increase my number of cantrips prepped. I'm more likely to drop it down to 2 or 3 and simply prep a wider range of higher level spells because knowing more higher level spells outweighs knowing cantrips.

Book of Shadows is good on a warlock because of the limitations on pact magic (plus non-warlock cantrips). Wizards don't have that limitation so the incentive to add at-will abilities is starts out high and drops over time.

I'm never going to take 5 or 6 cantrips at high levels over prepping spells. The only way for that to be true is if I were forced to do so in the mechanics, which is something your changes would not create.

If you were to impose a restriction where wizards preps normally for spells and preps cantrips equal to the proficiency bonus that would work better. It's also pointless over simply enforcing the cantrips known on the table as cantrips a wizard can prepare.

The other option in mixing and matching cantrips and spells is in making the choice have more meaning, as per my earlier comment where you don't add any bonuses to spells prepped at all. That means a wizard will likely start with 2 or 3 spells prepped, 1 or 2 cantrips prepped, and still carry rituals. That gives flavor to the class and creates a meaningful choice in cantrips. It would likely result in less cantrips at every level to reinforce daily casting but it's something wizards can afford given the large number of spells they can prep given their ritual casting mechanic.

In any case, giving wizards more standard spells prepped isn't a buff I think should be endorsed, which is ultimately what you proposal does.

 

[Xeviat]

I think they're not in the spell book so that you still have access to magic if your book is taken away.

I do like the idea of the wizard being able to learn more cantrips and swap them out. I'd probably go with Int mod+1 cantrips prepared and just let them have an extra known. Make them need their book to change them but let them stay in memory forever.

 

[cbwjm]

I've thought of doing similar, but rather than increasing the number of spells prepared and adding cantrips to the pool of prepared spells, I was planning on using the number of cantrips known as the slots for cantrips so a 1st level wizard with 3 cantrips known would be able to swap out and prepare any 3 of their known cantrips.

 

[Ashrym]

I've thought of doing similar, but rather than increasing the number of spells prepared and adding cantrips to the pool of prepared spells, I was planning on using the number of cantrips known as the slots for cantrips so a 1st level wizard with 3 cantrips known would be able to swap out and prepare any 3 of their known cantrips.

I think that makes more sense. Simply allowing swapping cantrips instead of swapping cantrips for higher level spells prepped.

 

[Salthorae]

I like this a bit. Love to hear how a playtest goes.

 

[Ashrym]

After giving it some thought, I think I would go with starting with 4 cantrips in the spell book. At levels 4 and 10 add one cantrip to the spell book for free as part of ongoing learning. Scribe cantrips found to the spell book at the cost of 1st level spells (the minimum cost). Prepare a number of cantrips equal to the wizard's INT bonus each day. Traditions that add a known cantrip consider that cantrip prepared and does not count against spells prepared.

Don't mix and match cantrips and other spells.

If a person is going to change wizards then changing other prepared casters to match would follow suit. Use the same rules for clerics and druids, except they would choose from among all cantrips on their spells lists like they do regular prepped spells.

I don't see why a person would change cantrip prepping for a single class instead of all spells prepped classes.

 

[Hawk Diesel]

So reading through the comments, I can see now the issue with combining the number of memorized spells and cantrips. I think I would keep it with starting with 4 cantrips in a wizard's spellbook. I might have the number a wizard can memorize being equal to their proficiency bonus. Wizards can learn additional cantrips by choosing one as one of their two spells they gain each level, finding new ones on scrolls to scribe in their spellbook, or research. I also kinda like @Ashrym 's idea as well.

I would do similar with other prepared casters, such as clerics and druids. They can prepare a number of cantrips from their spell lists equal to their proficiency bonus. Maybe even give clerics a domain cantrip.