Charging through an ally?

[Smurtis]

You can even charge while climbing, even though you move at half speed while doing it. Charging is pretty liberal in 4th Edition.

One rule I've heard thrown about but that I haven't actually seen written anywhere is that you have to be able to see the target of your charge when you start charging. I don't believe that's actually the case - for instance, I believe you can charge a drow that has dropped its cloud of darkness around itself or between you and it. Can anyone confirm one way or the other?

I would imagine you could charge a square, but take the appropriate negatives of attacking blindly... assuming the target is in the square (may have moved after dropping the cloud)...

 

[OnlineDM]

Right. I'm also referring to a situation where the cloud is between you and the enemy, but the enemy isn't hidden (they failed their Stealth check, so you know what square they're in). By the time you get to them (through the cloud), there will be no penalty to the attack.

The same applies with charging around a corner, as long as every step brings you closer to the target. Even if you can't see the target when you start, you still know where they are unless they've made a Stealth check to become hidden, and you can still charge them.

 

[the Jester]

Jester, what is the "clear path" phrase?

IDHM4eBIFOM so I'm probably conflating 3e with 4e here. That said, I still think it's a perfectly reasonable restriction and run charging that way myself.

That said, I don't typically allow a climbing, swimming, etc. charge unless the creature doing the charging has a climb, swim, etc. speed. Nor do I allow someone to charge an enemy that they don't know is there at the start of his charge- he can charge a square he can't see, but can't change where he is charging to midway through and treats that square as a target. You can't start a charge behind a corner, round the corner, spot your enemy, pick a target and THEN finish the charge, at least not in my game.

 

[malraux]

IDHM4eBIFOM so I'm probably conflating 3e with 4e here. That said, I still think it's a perfectly reasonable restriction and run charging that way myself.

That said, I don't typically allow a climbing, swimming, etc. charge unless the creature doing the charging has a climb, swim, etc. speed. Nor do I allow someone to charge an enemy that they don't know is there at the start of his charge- he can charge a square he can't see, but can't change where he is charging to midway through and treats that square as a target. You can't start a charge behind a corner, round the corner, spot your enemy, pick a target and THEN finish the charge, at least not in my game.

By the rules though, he can walk around a corner, see the enemy, then charge. Charging is only a standard action, not a full round action.

 

[OnlineDM]

IDHM4eBIFOM so I'm probably conflating 3e with 4e here. That said, I still think it's a perfectly reasonable restriction and run charging that way myself.

That said, I don't typically allow a climbing, swimming, etc. charge unless the creature doing the charging has a climb, swim, etc. speed. Nor do I allow someone to charge an enemy that they don't know is there at the start of his charge- he can charge a square he can't see, but can't change where he is charging to midway through and treats that square as a target. You can't start a charge behind a corner, round the corner, spot your enemy, pick a target and THEN finish the charge, at least not in my game.

Agreed. But if you know what square the enemy is in around the corner (you can hear them, even though they're out of sight), I allow a charge. If they don't know the bad guy is there, though, I'm with you - no charge allowed. I won't allow a double move to be converted into a charge halfway through the second move action if a bad guy is discovered (but if you discover them after the first move action, you can decide to charge instead of double moving).

 

[aurance]

IDHM4eBIFOM

I'm so proud of myself for figuring out that this meant "I Don't Have My 4e Books In Front of Me"! Yay me! Hurray aurance!!!!!

...

Yeah... I don't get out much.

 

[the Jester]

By the rules though, he can walk around a corner, see the enemy, then charge. Charging is only a standard action, not a full round action.

Sure, and I have no problem with that- if he walks around the corner with a move action, then spends his standard to charge. It's "move up to short of the corner, then charge at this guy who I can't see until I'm around the corner midway through my charge" that I don't allow.

But if you know what square the enemy is in around the corner (you can hear them, even though they're out of sight), I allow a charge.

This hasn't come up in my game, but I'd rule that the pc could charge in this instance too.

 

[SteveC]

I think this is an example of why the Rules Compendium is such a good product. We had this question last weekend in our game, and it was immediately solved. Lots of good stuff in that book.

 

[Colmarr]

It really isn't reasonable at all. It's a needless nerf for charge-based characters, and goes against the idea of teamwork.

Given the current meta-game strength of chargers, is there such a thing as a needless nerf to them?

The same applies with charging around a corner, as long as every step brings you closer to the target.

And it's worth noting that, IIRC, 4e doesn't count distance through blocking terrain such as walls. So even if going around the corner takes you away from a straight line to the target, each squares is still technically taking you closer to the target.

I'm so proud of myself for figuring out that this meant "I Don't Have My 4e Books In Front of Me"!

The irony is that AFB (Away From Books) is both much shorter and easier to understand.

 

[Jhaelen]

The irony is that AFB (Away From Books) is both much shorter and easier to understand.

... and that's exactly what I've been thinking after figuring out what Jester's monstrous acronym meant