D&D (2024) Check Out The New Monster Manual’s Ancient Gold Dragon

Wizards of the Coast has previewed (part of) the stat block for one of its iconic monsters on social media. Take a look!

 

[UngeheuerLich]

On the other hand, rocking an intelligence of 18, the gold dragon may prioritise a way to deal with enemies that are immune to its fiery breath. Poison gas? Something fast acting before the target can dimension door out is preferred, and a dependence on falling into the hazard cannot be relied upon.

But PC wizards have int 20 or more at this point. So they are even more well prepared.
(The real limit is player/dm creativity ad I prefer not to engage in an arm's race of who finds the better rules "exploit").

 

[Paul Farquhar]

But PC wizards have int 20 or more at this point. So they are even more well prepared.
(The real limit is player/dm creativity ad I prefer not to engage in an arm's race of who finds the better rules "exploit").

It's not a rules exploit if they act within their knowledge of the world. The dragon and the PC wizard are both considerably smarter than the person playing them, so both should be played to their controllers maximum ability.

 

[Upper_Krust]

But less than reliable. The fighter has legendary resistances of their own.

Yes the 2024 update of Indomitable looks unbelievably good (if a tad overpowered) - I think that alone makes me believe the dragon might be in trouble again.

If they have mage slayer, one extra get out of jail.

Well you get Advantage...unless that has changed as well?

And maybe they have other save bonus so they can actually make the save. Bless, bardic inspiration, Paladin aura, non dumped charisma. In that case being a gnome can help.

Well unless you are stacking multiples of those a typical character non-proficient in Charisma Saves, is still going to need around a 20 to save.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It's not a rules exploit if they act within their knowledge of the world.

Yes. Same goes for PCs.

I think it is dangerous to start optimizing against all possible tactics players could bring to the table.

Certainly a gold dragon has heard about the epic PCs. And a little bit of preparation is ok. But you shoud be wary not to overdo it.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Yes. Same goes for PCs.

I think it is dangerous to start optimizing against all possible tactics players could bring to the table.

Certainly a gold dragon has heard about the epic PCs. And a little bit of preparation is ok. But you shoud be wary not to overdo it.

The dragon is thousands of years old, it probably had many threats it's needed to prepare it's lair against over the course of it's lifetime.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Typically this character is also the least threat, so no.

Not based on my experience.

That said, the new (crazy powerful) 2024 change to Indomitable solves this issue for straight Fighters.

Anyway, I do not allow monsters to know how many hp or AC player characters have, and more than the player characters are allowed to know the monster's stats.

Well I mean how dumb does the Ancient Gold Dragon have to be to not know Fighter's and Barbarians are "tougher" than Wizards and Rogues?

Rip the wizard apart with physical damage, send the cleric to the oubliette, stay out of reach of the fighters and barbarians.

Fighters and Barbarians stand with the Wizard then.

Banishing the Cleric might be a valid tactic (in light of the 2024 Fighter upgrades).

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Yes the 2024 update of Indomitable looks unbelievably good (if a tad overpowered) - I think that alone makes me believe the dragon might be in trouble again.



Well you get Advantage...unless that has changed as well?

Yes. 1/short rest succeed on a mental save.

Well unless you are stacking multiples of those a typical character non-proficient in Charisma Saves, is still going to need around a 20 to save.

Yes. Of course. That is what I meant.

Lets say bardic inspiration and bless (+1d12+1d4 and 12(+1) charisma.)

That is an average bonus of +10. With advantage it is close to a coin flip.

Maybe a ring or cloak of protection on top.

We are speaking of level 20. That dragon will be in trouble if they are alone vs a party of 4.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

The dragon is thousands of years old, it probably had many threats it's needed to prepare it's lair against over the course of it's lifetime.

Of course. And still you should not overdo it. It is setting a bad example.

It is against the good faith interpretation/use of the rules.

Maybe the ability should say it needs to be a safe place the dragon can see. But even then a clever dragon can work around that.
If the DM want to make a very unfun encounter, they can always do that. No need to have elaborate death traps.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Yes. 1/short rest succeed on a mental save.

Goodness me!

Stack that with (the new) Indomitable and you practically get 4 x Legendary resistance per day.

Yes. Of course. That is what I meant.

Lets say bardic inspiration and bless (+1d12+1d4 and 12(+1) charisma.)

That is an average bonus of +10. With advantage it is close to a coin flip.

If only Bards weren't the second least chosen class (at Epic Tier).

Maybe a ring or cloak of protection on top.

Absolutely.

We are speaking of level 20. That dragon will be in trouble if they are alone vs a party of 4.

Possibly, but the XP Reward is for a Highly Difficult encounter.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Goodness me!

Stack that with (the new) Indomitable and you practically get 4 x Legendary resistance per day.

Mage slayer is a true gem now.

If only Bards weren't the second least chosen class (at Epic Tier).



Absolutely.



Possibly, but the XP Reward is for a Highly Difficult encounter.

I think that hits the mark. You probably should not target the fighter. The barbarian or paladin or wizard might be a better choice.

Some thing I noted:

What happens if the dragon is dead while someone is in the demi plane?

The banished creature returns to a space of the dragon's choice. What if the dragon can't make any choices anymore?