D&D General Circle Magic Concerns In "Heroes Of Faerun"

[Crit Hit The Giant]

I am really excited about the new Forgotten Realms books that released, but I am a bit concerned about Circle Magic and how it's structured.

For example, someone pointed out to me how you could theoretically use Circle Magic to cast Fireball a mile away and not even need to see the area you are casting it in since the spell doesn't require you to have to see the point of origin (and you could have someone scout it out and report back using another way/feature).

I think the idea is really cool but I can see this causing some issues here. Has anyone heard the designers talk about this? What are everyone's thoughts about this?

 

[EzekielRaiden]

I am really excited about the new Forgotten Realms books that released, but I am a bit concerned about Circle Magic and how it's structured.

For example, someone pointed out to me how you could theoretically use Circle Magic to cast Fireball a mile away and not even need to see the area you are casting it in since the spell doesn't require you to have to see the point of origin (and you could have someone scout it out and report back using another way/feature).

I think the idea is really cool but I can see this causing some issues here. Has anyone heard the designers talk about this? What are everyone's thoughts about this?

Given the loosey-goosey, "you're the GM, you figure it out" design of 5e, I doubt this will be even remotely an issue.

5e is never going to be a game where the rules just inherently work out of the box. That was, quite literally, one of the design intents, leaving a portion of the design for the GM to figure out. They're just adding new elements that also expect such.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

i don't even think that'd even be a problem if it extended the casting time, but it sounds like it doesn't. so the meteor swarm hypothetical the article poses would just play like "They're casting the spe--AAAAAND they rolled first in initiative. Welp. There goes Waterdeep."

 

[Crit Hit The Giant]

Given the loosey-goosey, "you're the GM, you figure it out" design of 5e, I doubt this will be even remotely an issue.

5e is never going to be a game where the rules just inherently work out of the box. That was, quite literally, one of the design intents, leaving a portion of the design for the GM to figure out. They're just adding new elements that also expect such.

Yeah, I understand leaving some ambiguity to allow your table to decide. But I feel like as a ruleset, this opens up a whole can of worms to the point that it's probably easier to just not use it as an option at all given how much of a headache this could be and how this could potentially negate encounters, challenges, and plot hooks. But I could be wrong.

 

[Crit Hit The Giant]

i don't even think that'd even be a problem if it extended the casting time, but it sounds like it doesn't. so the meteor swarm hypothetical the article poses would just play like "They're casting the spe--AAAAAND they rolled first in initiative. Welp. There goes Waterdeep."

lol right?!?

Part of me wonders if this could be adjusted by saying any spell that uses Augment requires you to be able to see the area in which you are casting it?

 

[Yaarel]

In a mage war, spells that prevent divination would probably work against a remote Circle Magic being able to target?

 

[Crit Hit The Giant]

In a mage war, spells that prevent divination would probably work against a remote Circle Magic being able to target?

But in a dungeon with a Dragon...

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Yeah, I understand leaving some ambiguity to allow your table to decide. But I feel like as a ruleset, this opens up a whole can of worms to the point that it's probably easier to just not use it as an option at all given how much of a headache this could be and how this could potentially negate encounters, challenges, and plot hooks. But I could be wrong.

That's the issue though.

It was never "leaving room for different people to evaluate things differently". It was often described that way, I freely admit. But it has always been "if the rules don't work as written, the GM will figure it out". That's one of the reasons I generally dislike the design of 5e. You're paying $60 a book (or whatever) for the privilege of reworking someone else's game design efforts.

This is precisely the same ethos. They aren't going to test it. They aren't going to dig deeper and check for plausible conflicts. They're just going to publish it. If we're lucky, we might see GMing advice for adjudication of edge cases. I don't expect anything on that front though, apart from a token "this is a powerful option" disclaimer that offers no actual guidance about its usage.

 

[Umbran]

I would generally wait to see the whole implementation before having concerns.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

I am really excited about the new Forgotten Realms books that released, but I am a bit concerned about Circle Magic and how it's structured.

For example, someone pointed out to me how you could theoretically use Circle Magic to cast Fireball a mile away and not even need to see the area you are casting it in since the spell doesn't require you to have to see the point of origin (and you could have someone scout it out and report back using another way/feature).

I think the idea is really cool but I can see this causing some issues here. Has anyone heard the designers talk about this? What are everyone's thoughts about this?

I think, one need to apply some common sense here. Fireballs at a mile is similar to smoothbore gunpowder artillery, doable but they would need line of sight and unless they have pre-measured the range or some accurate method of range finding. I think I would ask for an Int check for range estimation.
It is worth noting that a mile needs a total of 7 casters in the circle. A Waterdeep wide Meteor Swarm would require an absolute boatload of casters with nineth level slots.