Combatants as Cover & Ref Saves

[godfear]

This may have been covered already, but...

Say you have a group of enemies all lined up perfectly for a lightning bolt spell. The spellcaster fires it off, and everyone has to make their save. Does everyone except the first guy in the path gain the 1/2 cover bonus (+2 to Ref) to their saving throws because of those between them and the caster?

Just a thought.

 

[godfear]

Nothing?

 

[Furn_Darkside]

Salutations,

Hmm, this is a tough one.

Technically, they probably should get the bonus.

However- I always picture the bonus from cover being given because the cover provides protection from whatever you are making the relfex save to avoid.

That does not carry water in this case- since the l.bolt goes through creatures. They are offering no additional protection when behind them.

So, I would probably not give the bonus. It seems inconsistant with the spell.

FD

 

[Dr. Zoom]

By the rules, yes, they should get the extra +2 to their reflex save. In the same way, if someone is standing between a character and the detonation of a fireball, they get the cover bonus, too.

 

[doktorstick]

Hah! I had never considered that. Typically, if I have X----ABCDE, the attack comes from X, each letter is a 5-ft. square, and each creature is meduim-size, I grant B 1/2 cover, C 3/4 cover, D 9/10 cover and E full cover.

I think there have been some pretty detailed posts on how much cover to grant based on size categories, number of creatures, etc.

But, back to your original post... I guess by the letter of the law those characters would gain bonus to their reflex saving throws.

Cheers,
/ds

 

[Plane Sailing]

I think whether I granted the reflex bonus would depend on whether the person in front made his save or not - if he dived for cover (i.e. saved), you don't get it - if he failed his save you do...

 

[Umbran]

I'm note sure that merely standing in the next 5' square back assures that you're directly behind the other person. There's actually a lot of space in two 5' squares - they could well be lined up for purposes of the lightning bolt, but not standing directly behind one another.

Unless the folks behind the first in line specifically state they're using the first guy as cover (the poor sap), I might well rule the followers only have one-quarter cover, rather than one half.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

That's why it is 1/2 cover, not 3/4 or 9/10.

 

[KarinsDad]

Short answer: no.

Cover only applies if the cover affects the effect being used.

The characters in front of you do not give you actual cover from a Lightning Bolt since the area of effect of the Lightning Bolt is that entire area. It does not break up when it hits someone in front of you.

Ditto for Fireball.

If it were a bunch of arrows being fired at you, then yes, the cover would apply since the cover could result in actually stopping or deflecting a missile.

But, nothing here stops or deflects the Lightning Bolt. It covers the entire area.

From SRD: "For bursts, cones, cylinders, and emanating spells, the spell only affects areas, creatures, or objects to which it has line of effect from its origin (a burst's point, a cone's starting point, a cylinder's circle, or an emanating spell's point of origin).

An otherwise solid barrier with a hole of at least 1 square foot through it does not block a spell's line of effect."

There is a diagram in the PHB that illustrates what is and is not effected in line of effect.

 

[doktorstick]

So if someone is hiding behind a tree that is 4 ft. 11 in. wide and you fire a lightning bolt which is 5 ft. wide, the line of effect exists and, for the purpose of the spell, passes through thereby hitting the creature behind the tree? I know it is contrived, but that is what it sounded like...

/ds