Command Spell Question

[Larcen]

First chance I get I am using an Extended Command then. It'll be worth making the spell second level for that extra round I'll need to CDG the dude.

I am responding to my own quote because I realized how silly it was. Why use an Extended Command to paralyze someone when Hold Person is the same level and so much better? Hold person lasts longer and has a higher DC.

But I suppose Extended Command can be used against any creature that can understand you, not just humanoid of Medium-size or smaller, which is of some benefit over Hold Person.

... The target can only do things within their ability. Instant sleep is not within most people's ability...

... For sleep would they feign sleep? Fake snoring but one eye open? ...

I disagree with this. A person who is "faking" sleep is still helpless. They must fake sleep for a full round, period. Whether they want to get up or not. It's exactly like when they fake being dead; They are not dead, but must lie there the full round. It makes little difference if they are faking being dead or faking being asleep. They are helpess either way. And no one sleeps with one eye open, so they wouldn't do it under the effects of this spell either. Well...maybe Elves do.

 

[Artoomis]

Command is a really simple spell where the word spoken is not taken in context, it is taken on its face.

The person on the roof will likely fall when jumping (if the roof has a slope), but most likely would NOT jump off the roof.

If you want your target to drink what you are offering, then you should be sure that what you are offering is at least the closest drink available. In that way, you are influencing what they do with your "Command," but gestures and the like to try and put your Command in context won't work.

 

[AGGEMAM]

Anyway, on to my question at hand:

Can a Command spell be issued along with visual clues? Let me explain by using examples.

For those of you who don't know it, this very question spurred the longest thread I have ever seen on the board, and a darn funny one at that. IIRC, it was over 800 posts long, one of the main contributers was Uller_PSU.

The good ol' days ... hmm ...

 

[Voadam]

I disagree with this. A person who is "faking" sleep is still helpless. They must fake sleep for a full round, period. Whether they want to get up or not. It's exactly like when they fake being dead; They are not dead, but must lie there the full round. It makes little difference if they are faking being dead or faking being asleep. They are helpess either way. And no one sleeps with one eye open, so they wouldn't do it under the effects of this spell either. Well...maybe Elves do.

Ah, but people faking sleep might.

Look at it as if you are playing simon says with a kid. You tell a kid simon says jump, and the kid will jump. If you (inappropriately) tell them simon says die, and they go along with it they will clutch their heart, gurgle a bit and flop over pretending to die dramatically. Tell them simon says sleep and they will slide to the ground, maybe put their head on their hands and snore loudly. But I would expect a few would keep an eye open even when faking sleep or death. A clever kid could even go down then get up and when asked what he is doing say "I'm sleep walking"

The image of getting up and attacking a spell caster after he commands you to die is pretty funny, "How did you do that?" "I was faking being one of the restless angry dead who don't stay down."

 

[Dr. Zoom]

Unfortunately, I can't recall where I saw/heard of it. I just checked the FAQ too, just in case that was it, but not so. I guess unless somebody else comes up with a reference, I'll presume I was mistaken.

I did not think you were mistaken, I just would have like to see what/how the sage ruled.

So I took it upon myself to fire off a question to the sage about this to see if he could add some clarification. He responded today. Here is my question and his answer.

My Question:
There is a discussion on the EN World Messageboards about whether or not the Command spell can render the target helpless and thus subject to a coup de grace attack, using the command to "die" or "sleep." Someone said that they thought you had ruled somewhere that Command cannot render anyone helpless
in this manner. We know the caster cannot do it the next round unless hasted or using the Extend spell feat, but what about his allies after he casts the spell.

Any clarification would be most helpful.

The Sage's Response:
A command to "sleep" or "die" makes the subject prone and stunned, not helpless (sez me).