Complete Warrior base classes
- Thread starter mfrench
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Solarious
Explorer
As stated before universally by the masses: "What Samurai? I know nothing of this 'samurai' you speak of."
Hexblade is interesting, although slightly underpowered. I like the variant where they replace their spellcasting with some Invocations, however. It might make the class worthwhile.
Hexblade is interesting, although slightly underpowered. I like the variant where they replace their spellcasting with some Invocations, however. It might make the class worthwhile.
DarkMaster
First Post
I don't agree with that statement. Being able to use to use two weapons with a Dex as low as 3 is much better than the feat. It allows you in a point build to focus on strenght instead of Dexterity.Klaus said:
Klaus
First Post
Yes, it's a powerful ability. *IF* it applied to any 2 weapons. But restricting it to only a bastard/short combo means that, if you lose either weapon, you just lost a significant part of your class features.
Like I suggested above, the ability should have granted 2 Weapon feats which would function with any weapon, and grant you a bonus if you wield a bastard/short combo. Instead of punishing, you're rewarding.
Like I suggested above, the ability should have granted 2 Weapon feats which would function with any weapon, and grant you a bonus if you wield a bastard/short combo. Instead of punishing, you're rewarding.
Klaus said:
Sadly enough, this is also true of a wizard who loses his spellbook, a fighter specialised in longswords who loses his longsword, or a priest who loses his faith.
That's not a problem.My greatest problem with the samurai actually doesn't come from the samurai - it's that the basic Intimidate ability in combat is so weak. It shouldn't be. Giving up your turn to intimidate your opponents should give you some benefit. It doesn't. That the samurai gains the ability to intimidate as a move action at 14th level is bad design piled on top of bad design.
Cheers!
Klaus
First Post
Yes, but a Wizard who loses his spellbook isn't suddenly out of spells, and a longsword specialist who loses his longsword will probably lose the benefits of Focus and Specialization, but overall he can be about 80% as effective swinging any other weapon, and a priest who loses his faith is just a spotlight-hog aiming for extra XP (but a priest who loses his holy symbol *is* suddenly out of spells).
DarkMaster
First Post
Well the samurai loses access only to one to three feats which according to your comparison is 80% of his effectiveness. I don't think you fully realise how being able to use two weapon without having a high dex can be powerfull, especially in a point buy.Klaus said:Yes, but a Wizard who loses his spellbook isn't suddenly out of spells, and a longsword specialist who loses his longsword will probably lose the benefits of Focus and Specialization, but overall he can be about 80% as effective swinging any other weapon, and a priest who loses his faith is just a spotlight-hog aiming for extra XP (but a priest who loses his holy symbol *is* suddenly out of spells).
The samurai fills a hole in the core class. It allow to create an heavily armored effective two weapon figther. The problem is that they're isn't much support in terms of feat and samurai class ability to support the combat style. without dipping into rogue level (which just slow down his two weapon style progression since it's directly related to the Samurai level) the samurai won't be able to keep up with the two-handed weapon warrior in terms of damage.
And the other ability like MerricB says aren't that great.
BLACKDIRGE
Adventurer
I have not had any experience with the swashbuckler and the samurai, but I am currently playing a hexblde and loving it.
I am presently ninth level and I have found that the Hexblade is not under powered, as it might seem at first glance, and is in fact quite versatile with a decent set of skills and a useful spell list.
I have found the hexblade curse to be a life saver, as it has sevrely weakned powerful opponents and allowed them to fall prey to the spells and abilities of other party members, especially our red wizard enchanter. I typically save my curses for the big bad, and now that I can use it three times per day I have a very good shot at landing it.
Another good point is the arcane resistance/mettle combo, which, with my high charisma, has allowed me to survive many a magical attack unscathed.
Personally, I think the hexblade is a solid class, and so far I have no complaints.
BD
I am presently ninth level and I have found that the Hexblade is not under powered, as it might seem at first glance, and is in fact quite versatile with a decent set of skills and a useful spell list.
I have found the hexblade curse to be a life saver, as it has sevrely weakned powerful opponents and allowed them to fall prey to the spells and abilities of other party members, especially our red wizard enchanter. I typically save my curses for the big bad, and now that I can use it three times per day I have a very good shot at landing it.
Another good point is the arcane resistance/mettle combo, which, with my high charisma, has allowed me to survive many a magical attack unscathed.
Personally, I think the hexblade is a solid class, and so far I have no complaints.
BD
airwalkrr
Adventurer
I'll just toss my two coppers into this conversation. The hexblade is a poorly designed class. The class requires good Strength and Constitution scores because it is essentially a fighting class. It also requires a good Dexterity because you are limited to light armor. Plus you need Charisma to make your special abilities and spells work well. Intelligence and Wisdom aren't exactly dump stats because it has a poor Will save and poor skill set. I think the class is fixed well enough if you give it heavy or at least medium armor proficiency without affecting spellcasting.
The swashbuckler is not exactly what I would call a weak class, simply a difficult-to-play class. Like the hexblade, it requires several good ability scores, but it benefits from a host of more useful and versatile special abilities and a much better skill set. I know several people who say the class just plain sucks, but these are the same people who say the monk and the bard suck (two of the most powerful, yet most difficult-to-play, classes in the game).
The samurai is a powerhouse. I would not recommend allowing it unless you are ready to crank up the power level a little bit in your game. That said, it is not necessarily more powerful than say, a barbarian and will not disrupt game balance too much. Perhaps the biggest difficulty is accomodating the flavor of the class if you don't play in an oriental setting. In this event, naming the class something else and giving typical members of the class different motivations and characteristics is not hard to do.
The swashbuckler is not exactly what I would call a weak class, simply a difficult-to-play class. Like the hexblade, it requires several good ability scores, but it benefits from a host of more useful and versatile special abilities and a much better skill set. I know several people who say the class just plain sucks, but these are the same people who say the monk and the bard suck (two of the most powerful, yet most difficult-to-play, classes in the game).
The samurai is a powerhouse. I would not recommend allowing it unless you are ready to crank up the power level a little bit in your game. That said, it is not necessarily more powerful than say, a barbarian and will not disrupt game balance too much. Perhaps the biggest difficulty is accomodating the flavor of the class if you don't play in an oriental setting. In this event, naming the class something else and giving typical members of the class different motivations and characteristics is not hard to do.
All of the classes are too weak to be included in a normal party without being a 5th wheel. I don't like them. That seems to be a problem with many of the new base classes, the ninja or shugenja, for example, seem to suffer from the same problem.
Take the samurai. It is a fighter variant focused on two-weapon fighting, which is already a inferior fighting style for most characters. It compounds this fundamental weakness by being a really crappy two-weapon fighter. It gets Two-Weapon Fighting a level later than normal, and Improved Two-Weapon Fighting and Greater Two-Weapon Fighting a full five levels later than a character that took the feats normally.
The class's other features include a much worse version of the paladin's smite evil ability, a weak Intimidate-related ability, and a moderately useful frightful presense ability gained at 20th level.
Take the samurai. It is a fighter variant focused on two-weapon fighting, which is already a inferior fighting style for most characters. It compounds this fundamental weakness by being a really crappy two-weapon fighter. It gets Two-Weapon Fighting a level later than normal, and Improved Two-Weapon Fighting and Greater Two-Weapon Fighting a full five levels later than a character that took the feats normally.
The class's other features include a much worse version of the paladin's smite evil ability, a weak Intimidate-related ability, and a moderately useful frightful presense ability gained at 20th level.
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