Converting First Edition Monsters
- Thread starter Shade
- Start date
Cleon
Legend
Cleon
Legend
So what do you fancy for feats? It gets four of them.
Hmm, its Subjugate Undead ability means it can qualify for Divine Might if it picks Power Attack.
Combat Reflexes ought to be a good match to its high Dex and 10 ft. reach.
That leaves one. Maybe something from the Power Attack tree like Cleave or Improved Sunder or a general defense boosted like Lightning Reflexes?
Hmm, its Subjugate Undead ability means it can qualify for Divine Might if it picks Power Attack.
Combat Reflexes ought to be a good match to its high Dex and 10 ft. reach.
That leaves one. Maybe something from the Power Attack tree like Cleave or Improved Sunder or a general defense boosted like Lightning Reflexes?
Cleon
Legend
Works for me!
Updating the Bone Tyrant Working Draft.
In the original source, a master always appears with six minions when summoned. No more no less.
I'd be OK allowing for more powerful masters to have more minions, or more powerful ones.
Cleon
Legend
Having their Advancement tied together would seem to make the most sense.
Maybe have the Minions gain a HD for every 2 or 3 HD the master gains?
So do you prefer a fixed number of minions or have the number increase as the Master gets tougher?
I guess we'd better decide on the Master's normal Hit Dice advancement at the same time, as the three issues are so closely tied together.
freyar
Extradimensional Explorer
A related question is if we're putting them into the same CC entry or two linked ones. I guess with linking, it doesn't make too much of a difference.
From looking at the original monster, it seems we should note that the Minions get banished back to the 9 Hells if the Master is destroyed. Seems like that would fit in Minion Bond. Or did we decide to drop that?
The original monster Masters always seemed to have 6 minions, so I guess we should stick to that. But maybe the Minions should gain 1 HD per every 3 or 4 HD the Master gains in advancment. I don't think I'd necessarily have the Masters change size, but HD advancement up to maybe 22 HD would work.
From looking at the original monster, it seems we should note that the Minions get banished back to the 9 Hells if the Master is destroyed. Seems like that would fit in Minion Bond. Or did we decide to drop that?
The original monster Masters always seemed to have 6 minions, so I guess we should stick to that. But maybe the Minions should gain 1 HD per every 3 or 4 HD the Master gains in advancment. I don't think I'd necessarily have the Masters change size, but HD advancement up to maybe 22 HD would work.
Cleon
Legend
I was assuming we'd make it two CC entries.
If we used one entry called a "Bone Tyrant, Master" and included the Minions as a subentry it'd hide the latter's stats more than they need to be. Hmm, and it'd raise the question as to whether the single entry should just be called a "Bone Tyrant".
I think we should keep the "banishing minions" bit. We just forgot to include it.
How about giving both Master and Minion a Dependence special quality, e.g.:
Minion Dependence (Ex): Should one of a bone tyrant master's minions be destroyed, the master immediately gains one positive level. This level persists until the master can return to the lower planes and bond with a replacement minion.
If a bone tyrant master is destroyed, all of its minions are immediately banished to the lower planes they originated from.
Master Dependence (Ex): If a bone tyrant minion is destroyed while it is bonded to a bone tyrant master, the master immediately gains one positive level. If the bone tyrant master is destroyed, the minion is immediately banished to the lower plane it originated from.
Yes, I think something along those lines would be easier.
Hmm, but if we put a HD entry in the Minions' Advancement, that'd mean a Master could bond with Minions that've already been Advanced, which doesn't seem right.
Wouldn't it be better to have a more powerful master give negative levels to Minions it has bonded with, so they get the normal benefits of a "level boost" (+1 bonus on attack rolls, saving throws, skill checks, ability checks; increase of 5 hit points; and +1 to effective level) for each negative level.
Then we just need to decide on a HD/negative level ratio.
I like a two-to-one ratio, since that'd mean the Minions and Master's BAB and good saves increase in time with each other.
Cleon
Legend
We could do this by modifying the "Minion Bond" or "Master Dependence" SQs.
Advancement: — (but see Master Dependence)
Master Dependence (Su): If a bone tyrant minion is destroyed while it is bonded to a bone tyrant master, the master immediately gains one positive level. If the bone tyrant master is destroyed, the minion is immediately banished to the lower plane it originated from.
In addition, if a bone tyrant master has advanced its Hit Dice, all minions it is bonded to gain one negative level for every 2 additional HD its master has. These negative levels provide the normal effects to the minions (being undead, each negative level gives a +1 bonus on attack rolls, saving throws, skill checks, ability checks; gain of 5 hit points; and +1 to effective level for spells and special abilities). The negative levels last until the minion bond is broken, a minion does not lose any if its master gains positive levels.
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