Converting monsters from Tales From The Infinite Staircase

[Cleon]

Yeah, that's definitely the problem. I agree with keeping it simple. How about we have it reverse the certain spell descriptors as you indicate, changing energy type for damage as appropriate, as well as "description" (ie, mirrored sunburst looks like a blast of inky blackness) and positive-negative energy effects (in the sunburst example, perhaps it partly heals undead and fungi).

We shouldn't forget it also covers "reversible" spells.

Anyhow, I'll try roughing something out...

Mirror Spells: Kamerel mirror magic includes a special class of spells called mirror spells. A mirror spell is a spell that can be cast as one of two spells whose effects are the opposite of each other. For example, enlarge person/reduce person is a mirror spell that acts as either enlarge person or reduce person when cast.

A kamerel spellcaster can use one mirror spell at each spell level they can cast, but they can use each spell level's mirror spell multiple times if they have more than one spell slot at that level. Each "half" of a mirror spell is usually a spell of the same level, but if the halves have different levels the mirror spell has the same spell level as the highest level half. For example, a light/darkness mirror spell would be a second level spell, since it combines the 2nd level darkness spell and the 0 level light spell. If a mirror spell has material or focus components, it requires the components of both of its halves to cast.

Their are two main categories of mirror spell.

A reversible mirror spells are mirror spells that combine two existing spells whose effects cancel each other out. For example, a cure wounds spell cancels the effect of a cause wounds spell, cause blindness/deafness cancels remove blindness/deafness, freedom cancels imprisonment, stone to flesh cancels flesh to stone and so on. A kamerel spellcaster can combine any such pair of spells into a single mirror spell.

An invertible mirror spell is an existing spell with the Light, Darkness, Fire or Cold descriptor that can be cast as a spell with the opposite descriptor. For example, a fireball/coldball mirror spell can be cast as a Fire spell doing fire damage or a Cold spell doing cold damage. A sunbeam/darkbeam mirror spell can be a Light spell that does double damage to creatures sensitive to sunlight or a Darkness spell that does double damage to creatures sensitive to total darkness.

 

[freyar]

That's a pretty good start. I can certainly get behind it, and it cleverly lets the DM choose mirror spells for NPCs. But I think we should take out the divine spells or else specify that divine spells can be cast as arcane mirror spells, since that was a concern we had previously. The other thing is that an invertible spell might be interesting to cancel. For example, fireballs and coldball cancelling. Or maybe we could say that mirror spell can counterspell either spell or something.

 

[Cleon]

That's a pretty good start. I can certainly get behind it, and it cleverly lets the DM choose mirror spells for NPCs. But I think we should take out the divine spells or else specify that divine spells can be cast as arcane mirror spells, since that was a concern we had previously. The other thing is that an invertible spell might be interesting to cancel. For example, fireballs and coldball cancelling. Or maybe we could say that mirror spell can counterspell either spell or something.

Well I think Kamerel Mirror Magic ought to be exclusively arcane, since their xenophobia would prevent them worshiping another entity to gain spells. That doesn't prevent them using cure/inflict or cause/remove spells though, since the Bard has arcane versions of some of those spells.

 

[Oryan77]

My group deviated a lot from the original adventure, but it looks like they may be getting on track after our next session next week. So I think we will be playing this Mirrored Library scenario in a session or two.

Thanks so much for the work on the Kamerel that you have done. I've noticed that there isn't a language mentioned in the working drafts. Should Kamerel just speak their own language since they are xenophobic?

That also got me to thinking about the Wizard having a familiar. Do you guys use alternate class features for your conversions? If so, what do you think about using one of the alternate features that replaces the familiar with something else? I was thinking that since they are xenophobic, maybe the mages wouldn't associate with a familiar? There are a few that I can see working well with the Kamerel in the Player's Handbook 2 pg 68, or in Unearthed Arcana pg 59-64.

 

[Cleon]

My group deviated a lot from the original adventure, but it looks like they may be getting on track after our next session next week. So I think we will be playing this Mirrored Library scenario in a session or two.

At the rate we're going I suspect they're not going to be finished by the time you run that scenario then!

Thanks so much for the work on the Kamerel that you have done. I've noticed that there isn't a language mentioned in the working drafts. Should Kamerel just speak their own language since they are xenophobic?

According to Tales from the Infinite Staircase Kamerel "speak their own language, but have learned (reluctantly) the common trade language of the planes".

I just haven't added languages to the working draft yet.

That also got me to thinking about the Wizard having a familiar. Do you guys use alternate class features for your conversions? If so, what do you think about using one of the alternate features that replaces the familiar with something else? I was thinking that since they are xenophobic, maybe the mages wouldn't associate with a familiar? There are a few that I can see working well with the Kamerel in the Player's Handbook 2 pg 68, or in Unearthed Arcana pg 59-64.

We've already been talking about giving them something instead of a familiar since post #163, but haven't settled on what.

 

[freyar]

Well, I can start prioritizing this --- posting here every day, anyway.

To keep things moving, I will agree to your proposed Mirror Spell ability (with cure/inflict included for kamerel bards), but I think it would be good to add a line "A mirror spell can be used to counterspell either of its halves" to the end of the second paragraph in the ability.

As for replacing the familiar, it looks like Mirror Spell was supposed to be the replacement!

 

[Cleon]

Well, I can start prioritizing this --- posting here every day, anyway.

To keep things moving, I will agree to your proposed Mirror Spell ability (with cure/inflict included for kamerel bards), but I think it would be good to add a line "A mirror spell can be used to counterspell either of its halves" to the end of the second paragraph in the ability.

As for replacing the familiar, it looks like Mirror Spell was supposed to be the replacement!

Agreed.

I'll wrap the Mirror Spells and Mirror Magic writeups together for clarity.

Revising...

Mirror Magic: Kamerel use a form of arcane magic that functions more easily in the Outlands than normal magic. Rather than needing to succeed at a DC 35 Spellcraft check to cast an impeded spell in the Outlands, a kamerel need succeed only at a DC equal to 20 plus the level of the spell (as if the Outlands had the standard Impeded Magic trait). Mirror magic, like normal magic, does not function at all within 100 miles of the Spire.

Kamerel cannot use divine magic, because their solipsistic xenophobia prevents them from calling upon the power of a god or other supernatural entity.

Kamerel are unable to use spell-completion or spell-trigger items created by other creatures, and cannot learn or decipher arcane spells written by other creatures. Contrariwise, non-kamerel cannot learn or decipher mirror magic spells or use spell-completion or spell-trigger items created by kamerel.

Kamerel spellcasters can gain levels in any arcane spellcasting classes, but they may have different class abilities from standard as detailed hereafter.

A kamerel wizard or sorcerer loses the ability to summon a familiar and gains the ability to cast mirror spells (see below).

A kamerel bard also gains the ability to cast mirror spells, but their bardic music abilities of suggestion and mass suggestion only work on kamerel. In addition, a kamerel bard can only use their bardic knowledge ability to gain information on kamerel and their works.

Mirror Spells: Kamerel mirror magic includes a special class of spells called mirror spells. A mirror spell is a spell that can be cast as one of two spells whose effects are the opposite of each other. For example, enlarge person/reduce person is a mirror spell that acts as either enlarge person or reduce person when cast.

A kamerel spellcaster can use one mirror spell at each spell level they can cast, but they can use each spell level's mirror spell multiple times if they have more than one spell slot at that level. Each "half" of a mirror spell is usually a spell of the same level, but if the halves have different levels the mirror spell has the same spell level as the highest level half. For example, a light/darkness mirror spell would be a second level spell, since it combines the 2nd level darkness spell and the 0 level light spell. If a mirror spell has material or focus components, it requires the components of both of its halves to cast.

A mirror spell can be used to counterspell either of its halves.

There are two main categories of mirror spell.

A reversible mirror spells are mirror spells that combine two existing spells whose effects cancel each other out. For example, a cure wounds spell cancels the effect of a inflict wounds spell, cause blindness/deafness cancels remove blindness/deafness, freedom cancels imprisonment, stone to flesh cancels flesh to stone and so on. A kamerel spellcaster can combine any such pair of spells into a single mirror spell.

An invertible mirror spell is an existing spell with the Light, Darkness, Fire or Cold descriptor that can be cast as a spell with the opposite descriptor. For example, a fireball/coldball mirror spell can be cast as a Fire spell doing fire damage or a Cold spell doing cold damage. A sunbeam/darkbeam mirror spell can be a Light spell that does double damage to creatures sensitive to sunlight or a Darkness spell that does double damage to creatures sensitive to total darkness.

 

[freyar]

Shouldn't cause wounds be inflict wounds?

Skills: max out Concentration, Knowledge (arcana), Listen, Spellcraft, Spot?

 

[Cleon]

Shouldn't cause wounds be inflict wounds?

Yes, I might have been reading too much AD&D recently.

It makes most sense to just edit my previous post than post the whole thing again.

Updating Mirror Magic.

Skills: max out Concentration, Knowledge (arcana), Listen, Spellcraft, Spot?

Spot and Listen are cross-class for a Wizard, so he'd have an odd rank left over.

Maybe some ranks in Craft (alchemy) or Knowledge (the planes) instead?

 

[freyar]

Errgh, I'm always forgetting that since normal monsters don't have cross-class skills. Definitely let's max Craft (alchemy). I'm less sure about Know. (the planes) since I don't think kamerel travel much. What about another Craft for making magic items?