Converting True Dragons

[freyar]

I'm getting the feeling that these are also best served as normal monsters, rather than age-category-true-dragons, like the hawkdragon, faerie dragon (their relative!), pseudodragon, etc. Anyone else?

 

[Cleon]

These look pretty straightforward. Again, I don't think we need bother with age categories for them since they don't gain any abilities as they get older.

So at-will empathy as a Psionics-Like-Ability plus a nasty poison spit (Con damage plus agony as per a symbol of pain?).

EDIT: Belay that! It says "corrosive spit" in the SA line, so acid damage plus agony? Oh, and it dissolves armour!

Reflex save for half acid damage and Fort/Will save to resist the pain?

EDITED EDIT: They've also got a few other powers.

20' empathy which gives them +4 to save vs attackers within range.

+4 save vs poison and acid. (acid resistance?)

Immune to charm and summon monsters. Don't recall seeing a creature immune to summoning before.

Blends into surroundings to surprise on 1-5. Just copy a pseudodragon's racial bonus to Hide from its chameleon skin.

 

[Cleon]

Okay then, the adults are 2 feet long with 3 hit dice so they could either be Tiny or Small.

I was going to go for Small, based on the feeling 3 HD is a bit high for Tiny, but I guess it's not that bad.

Hmm, there are a fair few references to their relationship with Black Dragons. A Wyrmling Blackie is Tiny and 4 Hit Dice, so I'll change my mind and go for Tiny.

Tiny Dragon
Hit Dice: 3d12

Pseudodragon: Str 6, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 10, +4 NA
Wyrmling Black Dragon: Str 11, Dex 10, Con 13, Int 8, Wis 11, Cha 8, +3 NA

Being Semi-Intelligent gives them Int 2-4. Their AC2 while flying matches a Pseudodragon's, but they have AC5 when not flying - I'd be inclined to interpret that as a flat-footed AC 3 less than normal, meaning Dex 16-17.

So, how about.

Minidragon: Str 8, Dex 17, Con 13, Int 4, Wis 12, Cha 5, +3 NA

 

[freyar]

Let's go with Tiny, and I like those abilities well enough.

Let's go with acid resistance 5 and maybe immunity to poison (or saving throw bonus).

Empathy seems best handled as an Su ability to grant those bonuses vs creatures within 20 ft.

Whta does immune to summon monsters mean? You can't summon them? That would seem best as flavor text.

 

[Shade]

Let's go with Tiny, and I like those abilities well enough.

Agreed. Added to Homebrews.

Let's go with acid resistance 5 and maybe immunity to poison (or saving throw bonus).

That works for me. I'm ambivalent on poison immunity vs. save bonus.

Empathy seems best handled as an Su ability to grant those bonuses vs creatures within 20 ft.

Yeah, probably.

Whta does immune to summon monsters mean? You can't summon them? That would seem best as flavor text.

Or better yet, left on the cutting room floor.

Dragons aren't really on most summon lists, anyway, so this relic of past editions can stay there.

 

[Cleon]

Let's go with Tiny, and I like those abilities well enough.

Let's go with acid resistance 5 and maybe immunity to poison (or saving throw bonus).

I would prefer acid resistance and a saving throw bonus against poison.

Empathy seems best handled as an Su ability to grant those bonuses vs creatures within 20 ft.

Works for me.

Whta does immune to summon monsters mean? You can't summon them? That would seem best as flavor text.

I think that's exactly what it means - spells with the Summoning descriptor simply don't work on Minidragons.

A curious little ability, I imagine a lot of minidragons are hunted at the behest of wizards trying to figure out what gives them their "no summoning" trait.

 

[freyar]

Ok, then, acid resistance 5 and a +4 saving throw bonus vs poison? (I'd be ok with cutting to a +2 bonus if the +4 seems too big.)

The +4 bonus on saving throws doesn't seem quite right for empathy, and neither does the psionic power (we might think about changing the name to avoid confusion). See what you think about this take on it. I could potentially go higher on the numbers here.

Empathy (Su): Minidragons continuously sense the emotional state of creatures within 20 ft. They gain a +1? insight bonus to AC against attacks made by and a +2? bonus to saves against effects originated by creatures within 20 ft. Futhermore, they have a +2? bonus to Spot and Listen checks against creatures within 20 ft.

I'd kind of like to switch the Spot/Listen bonus to an initiative bonus, but that seems to work against critters too far away.

I think I'm with Shade on dropping the summoning thing.

 

[RavinRay]

What does immune to summon monsters mean? You can't summon them? That would seem best as flavor text.

This is my take, but maybe for 3e it would discourage the DM from using them as special/alternative familiars.

 

[Cleon]

Ok, then, acid resistance 5 and a +4 saving throw bonus vs poison? (I'd be ok with cutting to a +2 bonus if the +4 seems too big.)

The +4 bonus on saving throws doesn't seem quite right for empathy, and neither does the psionic power (we might think about changing the name to avoid confusion). See what you think about this take on it. I could potentially go higher on the numbers here.

Empathy (Su): Minidragons continuously sense the emotional state of creatures within 20 ft. They gain a +1? insight bonus to AC against attacks made by and a +2? bonus to saves against effects originated by creatures within 20 ft. Futhermore, they have a +2? bonus to Spot and Listen checks against creatures within 20 ft.

I'd drop the AC bonus, since the original only affects saves, and add Sense Motive to the skills. I wouldn't mind boosting the skill bonuses too - it'd be hard to hide from something that can feel your mind. How about:

Empathy (Su): Minidragons continuously sense the emotional state of creatures within 20 ft. They gain a +2 insight? bonus to saves against effects originated by creatures within 20 ft. Futhermore, they have a +4 insight? bonus to Sense Motive, Spot and Listen checks against creatures within 20 ft.

 

[Shade]

Cleon's revision appeals to me, as does resistance to acid 5 and a +4 saving throw bonus vs poison.