Correct ruling on spell-like ability caster level?

[TessarrianDM]

If a creature with the half-fiend template takes 4 levels as a ranger (but its Wisdom score will not allow it to cast spells), would the caster level of it's spell-like abilities increase due to the increase in Hit Dice? My belief is that they will not, but I want to make sure. Please reference rule if possible. Thanks!

 

[kreynolds]

I am fairly certain the answer is yes. If the creature's Wisdom score is 8 or higher, it gains the spell-like abilities from the template and it's caster level increases with its HD. Spell-like abilities are not the same thing as spells. From the half-fiend template...

Spell-Like Abilities: A half-fiend with an Intelligence or Wisdom score of 8 or higher has spell-like abilities depending on its Hit Dice, as indicated on the table below. The abilities are cumulative. Unless otherwise noted, an ability is usable once per day. Caster level equals the creature’s HD, and the save DC is Charisma-based.

 

[Bad Paper]

If a creature with the half-fiend template takes 4 levels as a ranger (but its Wisdom score will not allow it to cast spells), would the caster level of it's spell-like abilities increase due to the increase in Hit Dice?

No. SLA are tied to racial hit dice. If you "advanced" the creature in its non-ranger hit dice, then yes, the SLA CL should increase.

 

[Nifft]

Ranger levels certainly do count as HD.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Wolfwood2]

No. SLA are tied to racial hit dice. If you "advanced" the creature in its non-ranger hit dice, then yes, the SLA CL should increase.

I disagree. Half-Fiend is most commonly going to be treated as an acquired template, not an inherited template. Most creatures aren't born half-fiends but rather become half-fiends as a result of some mystical process during their life.

As an acquired template, all hitdice apply, not just racial ones.

 

[Nifft]

There are some templates that make a distinction -- Half-Dragon's hit die increase, for example. Otherwise, HD are HD.

Cheers, -- N

 

[TessarrianDM]

In the Monster Manual, it just says "if no caster level is specified, the caster level is equal to the creature's Hit Dice". It does not state "racial Hit Dice". However, in Savage Species (admittedly a 3.0 book I have not found an update for), it gives an example of a nixie taking levels of sorcerer without those levels increasing the caster level of it's spell-like abilities. Unlike a half-fiend, the nixie's caster levels are not determined by it's Hit Dice.

The concern I have with the half-fiend is the Blasphemy special ability with its ability to kill creatures 10 HD lower than the caster level with no save. Those class Hit Dice can make a big difference (not in the case of this particular NPC, but with some others the party will face in the future).

Would you go with the Monster Manual definition and include all Hit Dice, or the older Savage Species definition and not count Hit Dice derived form class levels?

 

[frankthedm]

Uhm, guys, you might want to check the sample chatracter for the half fiend in the monster manual. IIRC the base critter was a human with class levels and I am darn sure she had her class HD counting toward her Half fiend SLA's.

Also unless class HD did count for the Half fiend's SLA's, there really is no way it would be LA+4.

 

[lottrbacchus]

I agree with Frank et al.

And Tess, you are right to worry about Blasphemy. There was a thread somewhere noting how Blasphemy is stronger than the other alignments' versions- Holy Word, for example.

Sooo- you could change Blasphemy to make it in line with Holy Word. But then you screw the Half-Fiend, who is weaker than the Half-Celestial until Blasphemy rolls into the picture.

(IMC, the PCs are Half-Celestial and there are quite a few Half-Fiends around, so I'm quite familiar with the problem. I'm fine with the high-HD HFs being able to murder everyone around, that's why the PCs have to fix everything.)

 

[Caliban]

Racial HD are not the same thing as Class HD, except when they are.

The rules are inconsistent on this point - some things are based solely on racial HD, other things are based solely on class HD, and some things are based the total of both. Sometimes it's the same thing, just used by a different creature/template.