CR on a trap

[cmanos]

Why do you need a CR for a trap that can't be disarmed? As I see it, if they avoid the trap by going no where near the trigger, they don't get the XP. If they screw with it, whomever triggers it gets screwed and everyone else gets a crapload of XP for something there is no way to avoid other than not going near it, in which case they get no XP.

How aboput you REALLY mess with them and make it undetectable as well?

If you're the DM, bet on seriously pissed off players.

If you're the player who got hit with it....find yourself a new DM.

 

[Nail]

Wow, what a load of $%@#^%@^. That trap is clearly outside the rules.

The DC for the save is off. The number of saves is wrong. The search/disable are wrong. The results of a spell is wrong.

Yuck. Why bother using it?

This reminds me of the "I hide the trap behind something so you can't disarm it" discussion.

 

[Nail]

What is the CR for a trap that a) Casts Wish upon the victim to permanently transform them into a Lemure, and then Gates them directly to the 9 hells? The trap does have a saving throw: DC 40 fort save. Also, and this is the really fun part: any attempt to disarm the trap automatically springs it.

Just to bring this trap back into 3.5e D&D:

"Spell Traps: Spell traps produce the spell’s effect. Like all spells, a spell trap that allows a saving throw has a save DC of 10 + spell level + caster’s relevant ability modifier."

In order for the Fort save to be DC 40, the caster would have to have a spell casting ability score of 52.

So....does the wizard who created the trap have an INT 52?

....sure he does.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Sounds like the general consensus is:

Either use the description of the wish spell, magical traps and the general formula for trap creation, resulting in a trap which
1. Can be disarmed
2. Can be saved against
and
3. Most certainly can be defeated at a later date using magic - most likely other 9th level spells

Mind you - I CAN think of a way to defeat the trap without disarming it - you simply conjure a force or effect to open the chest.

 

[ElvishBard]

Mind you - I CAN think of a way to defeat the trap without disarming it - you simply conjure a force or effect to open the chest.

Yeah, but how often does the rouge find a trap and tells the magic user to do it, as she needs to take a nap because she is tired of doing her job?

 

[moritheil]

That's lame. IMHO if the BBEG didn't kill anyone, and the DM insists on making up for it, the DM likely has some issues. The current BBEG of my campaign would most likely send half the group into the Land of Negative Health before being in any remote danger of death. The party realizes this and plans to gain experience before taking him on, but bottom line, if the group rolls well/plays well and wins without death, there's no reason to randomly throw one in. In a normally played campaign (noncinematic, that is, no fudging on the DM's part to save people from dying in random fights or to traps) there are enough deaths before the group ever fights the BBEG.

Of course, there are always unfamiliar DMs who do stupid things like play beholders as melee monsters. (Yes, I know the book suggests it, but it's the most idiotic thing you can do with a beholder, and entirely at odds with their massive intelligence scores. Do a few test runs and you'll soon see what I mean.) Sloppiness cannot be covered for with an arbitrary group death.

Except its really not since you can't get the person back. It's more of a guranteed death just in case the BBEG didn't kill anyone. Because any real game has to have a PC die.

 

[AuraSeer]

It's an instant irrevocable-death trap with (effectively) no save and no slightest possibility of avoiding it. And you want to know the CR.

I dunno, what's the CR of the DM saying "A rock falls on your head and you die?" That's the level of maturity we're looking at here.

 

[Arnwyn]

but it is a faithful translation of the adventure in question.

Not with a "DC 40" save it isn't.

 

[Nail]

That "DC 40" is someone converting it and pulling a number out of his ........

IMHO, there should be two saves: one for the transformation, one for the plane shift.

 

[noeuphoria]

Well, turns out there was a DC on the plane shift, a DC 27 will save, which our Dwarven Defender made on the nose, so luckily, he's just a perma-wished lemure now. Looks like my cleric will have to take it on the nose and Miracle him out of it (the 5000 exp casting of course). Actually, I thought of way to be a bastard about this. "Hmmm, I cast miracle.... ok, I'd like to duplicate Polymorph any Object. So he's a lemure, right? Ok.... well, I'll just make him into.... let's see, lemure's are outsiders... ok, an ASTRAL DEVA!!!. Hey buddy, good to have you onboard." The DM probably wouldn't go for it, but I think, by the RAW, since he's now an outsider, it would actually work.