Creating An OGC Setting

[Yair]

I'd like to create an OGC setting, as a Wiki (community) project. Anyone wants in?
The idea is to make it 100% OGC. I suggest to create it as a Wiki, allowing anyone to expand, alter, or present variants as he desires.

I think of the setting as an OGC alternative to place generic adventures in. I would want the setting to be similar enough to FR or GH so that nearly any adventure for them would be easily accomodated. I want to have deities that will be sufficiently close to the PH deities so that translations between them would be trivial, for example.
I would also like the setting to be more "realistic", however, taking into account D&D's rules, ecology, economy, making sense geographically, and so on.
I am starting by thinking of the ecology. I want to have a place for everything in the SRD, so I am slowly working my way through it looking at what creatures reside in each Environment. (I'll post the list later.) I'll then work out the ratios of the different predators and prey, and the amount thereof supported by land area. That should already give a good idea of how large we need the setting and landmasses to be, and give a good picture of each area. I think that's a good place to start.
I've got little so far, but was asked about this in another thread, so I opened this up. Perhaps prematurely.

I wouldn't be surprised if something like this was already out there, if anyone knows of a similar thing please do point it out.

Edit: A wiki was opened for this project here. If you wish to join it, please send me an email at peterpanimmortal at hotmail dot com.
Also, a Yahoo Group is open for this project, which you can join by visiting it at
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Tempest_ogcs/

 

[Angel Tarragon]

I'd be happy to contibute.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

I would suggest using a Wiki format that requires login - this way, lots of people would be able to contribute, but it would be easy to see who did what, and also easy to ban would-be contributors who don't know how to use OGC properly.

I'd also be interested in contributing, but since I have my own setting to work out, my time is limited. But feel free to look at Urbis for inspiration, since it also takes a look at some of the issues you mentioned...

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

Additional thoughts:

- Do you have webspace to host a Wiki and that also allows you to upload images (we need those for maps, among other things...).

- I wouldn't worry too much about realism, because when it gets down to it, no D&D setting is ever going to be truly realistic. I'd rather worry about plausibility, meaning that if there is a seeming logical hole ("Why does this desolate region support such big monsters?"), it would be more interesting to come up with a plausible explanation ("Maybe there's a magical source of food somewhere near it that allows the smaller creatures it eats to survive and prosper!") than removing the inconsistency itself ("No more terrible monsters for you, Mister Desert!"), since the former is usually more fun for a setting ("Hey, why can't we find any big monsters in this desert to fight? We were ripped off!"). Trying to work out a truly realistic ecology for all those D&D monsters would be the equivalent of a Ph.D. thesis, which I wouldn't recommend, since you are unlikely to get a Ph.D. thesis out of it.

- If you don't have them, I would recommend the three "Magical Society" books from Expeditious Retreat Press - "A Magical Medieval Society: Western Europe", "Ecology and Culture", and "Beast Builder".

 

[Yair]

Do you have webspace to host a Wiki and that also allows you to upload images (we need those for maps, among other things...).

I believe we can use Wikiplaces or Pbwiki, but I haven't looked into it in detail yet. Any suggestions are welcome.

I wouldn't worry too much about realism, because when it gets down to it, no D&D setting is ever going to be truly realistic. I'd rather worry about plausibility, meaning that if there is a seeming logical hole ("Why does this desolate region support such big monsters?"), it would be more interesting to come up with a plausible explanation ("Maybe there's a magical source of food somewhere near it that allows the smaller creatures it eats to survive and prosper!") than removing the inconsistency itself ("No more terrible monsters for you, Mister Desert!"), since the former is usually more fun for a setting ("Hey, why can't we find any big monsters in this desert to fight? We were ripped off!"). Trying to work out a truly realistic ecology for all those D&D monsters would be the equivalent of a Ph.D. thesis, which I wouldn't recommend, since you are unlikely to get a Ph.D. thesis out of it.

Yes, well, I do think I'll invest a few day's work into working out some semblance of an ecosystem. That's hardly a PhD thesis.
I've started by looking at (non-extraplanar and non-construct) monsters from the SRD, and I'm currently starting to tally them by environment and work out their EL. (I have it all in Excelt, but it's too large. I'll post it once I've finished and trimmed it, or on the wiki when we set it up.)
From that and their size, and a few ecological assumptions for the soil's productivity and predation ratios, coming up with a plausible model shouldn't be too much work.
I agree that complete realism is not desirable, or even possible. Plausibility is more like it. But I wonder what a plausible ecology would look like, so I want to find out.
I wish I could post the file...

If you don't have them, I would recommend the three "Magical Society" books from Expeditious Retreat Press - "A Magical Medieval Society: Western Europe", "Ecology and Culture", and "Beast Builder".

I'm rereading Ecology and Culture. I'm planning on basing a lot on it.
When it comes to designing kingdoms, I'm sure Western Europe will come in handy too.
I don't have Beast Builder, but I don't see how that's relevant. If we have enough room for all the SRD, we would certainly have room for almost anything else. The SRD is quite varied.

 

[Yair]

I'd also be interested in contributing, but since I have my own setting to work out, my time is limited. But feel free to look at Urbis for inspiration, since it also takes a look at some of the issues you mentioned...

Yes, I've browsed your site several times. An interesting setting, but not very similar of course. Hardly an FR clone.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

I believe we can use Wikiplaces or Pbwiki, but I haven't looked into it in detail yet. Any suggestions are welcome.

I don't have any, though I should note that many providers - such as Wikicities - already have "Open Content" licences that are incompatible with the OGL.

Ideally we'd want some private webspace where we can set up with our own Wiki, though that might cost money.

Yes, well, I do think I'll invest a few day's work into working out some semblance of an ecosystem. That's hardly a PhD thesis.

The problem is that most monsters in the SRD are predators - and big predators at that. You'd need a large number of prey animals for a complete ecosystem.

I've started by looking at (non-extraplanar and non-construct) monsters from the SRD, and I'm currently starting to tally them by environment and work out their EL. (I have it all in Excelt, but it's too large. I'll post it once I've finished and trimmed it, or on the wiki when we set it up.)
From that and their size, and a few ecological assumptions for the soil's productivity and predation ratios, coming up with a plausible model shouldn't be too much work.
I agree that complete realism is not desirable, or even possible. Plausibility is more like it. But I wonder what a plausible ecology would look like, so I want to find out.
I wish I could post the file...

Do you have some private webspace where you could upload it? If not, you can email it to me at jhubert AT gmx DOT de - I can upload it later in the evening and post the link here (and no, I can't host a Wiki on my web server - my brother was very definite about that...).

I'm rereading Ecology and Culture. I'm planning on basing a lot on it.
When it comes to designing kingdoms, I'm sure Western Europe will come in handy too.
I don't have Beast Builder, but I don't see how that's relevant. If we have enough room for all the SRD, we would certainly have room for almost anything else. The SRD is quite varied.

Like I said, there aren't many prey animals out there, apart from purely mundane ones. And that's boring...

EDIT: Hey, my 2000th post!

 

[Yair]

I don't have any, though I should note that many providers - such as Wikicities - already have "Open Content" licences that are incompatible with the OGL.

Ideally we'd want some private webspace where we can set up with our own Wiki, though that might cost money.

Pbwiki and Wikiplaces don't require a specific license (although wikiplaces won't tell you about that). I am not certain if they allow member-only editing, however.
I agree that a dedicated server will be most effective, but I'm not very keen on investing money...

The problem is that most monsters in the SRD are predators - and big predators at that. You'd need a large number of prey animals for a complete ecosystem.

Yes, well, I think I'll just fudge a biomass of herbivores, mostly. It would still be useful to know that a griffon flock requires about so-and-so Medium grazing animals to hunt on, for example.

Do you have some private webspace where you could upload it? If not, you can email it to me at jhubert AT gmx DOT de - I can upload it later in the evening and post the link here

No, not one that you could download from.
I am using the excel file at the bottom of this thread. I haven't done a lot on it yet.

EDIT: Hey, my 2000th post!

Congradulations.

I'll set up a (temporary ?) Wiki and upload the file to it tonight (I'm at work now).

Yair

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

Yes, well, I think I'll just fudge a biomass of herbivores, mostly. It would still be useful to know that a griffon flock requires about so-and-so Medium grazing animals to hunt on, for example.

Well, just how much do griffons have to eat? Especially given that they must need enormous amounts of energy to power those wings?

Personally, I prefer the "thaumivore" explanation in "Magical Society: Ecology and Culture" - magic energy gets into the food chain, and the predators accumulate enough of it to give them an extra energy burst, reduce their food requirement, and power their supernatural abilities. This allows you to fudge these things as much as you want. Nice and simple.

EDIT: We could also assume that regions that have lots of monsters have a larger "base amount" of magical energy in the environment, perhaps because of ancient magical disasters and civilizations in the region, perhaps for natural reasons.

And that's plausible enough for me...

 

[Yair]

Wiki created at
http://ogcs.wikispaces.com/

Now I really need to go to sleep.

Yair