Creative (but not annoying) Intelligence Penalties
- Thread starter Dachande
- Start date
jefgorbach
First Post
Kaladhan said:
Without looking, Im guessing house rule because I -think- they start with Common and Race, with your formula showing the max languages they can learn without feats/etc. IE: a elf starts knowing Common and Elven but can learn others (say Dwarven) once he encounters someone who knows it and willing to teach him; say another PC? -- meaning they could be in serious/comic problems if all the same race moving thru another race's region and too low INT to pickup the local language. ::evil laugh::
IMO Common is a placeholder for the campaign's "universally" accepted business langage, much like English is in much of our world.
Slife said:
Yep... And that's EXACTLY how the system is built to give low Int players their comeuppance!
Especially the "rites of the heathen god" mention... Because, the characters are also taking really standard/'useful' skills with the points they've got... So, I'm willing to bet there won't be much "Knowledge (_____________)" included.
Hopefully the Cleric is at least smart enough to take Knowledge (Religion)... I mean, c'mon... That's a no-brainer.
SavageRobby
First Post
Since you have so many (relatively speaking), you might ask each of the low Int players to define one or two characteristics of what their Low Int represents (as it doesn't necessary mean "stupid", there are often other contributing factors) - poor memory, slow on the uptake, clueless (lack of common knowledge), short attention span, easily distracted, illiterate/innumerate, narrow bandwidth (can only handle small amounts of information at any given time), etc.
Not only would they each have their own in-game mechanical effects, but this would help differentiate each character and make it that much more interesting. Plus, each characteristic could manifest themselves in various roleplaying ways, and you could even give your players an XP bonus for playing it properly.
Not only would they each have their own in-game mechanical effects, but this would help differentiate each character and make it that much more interesting. Plus, each characteristic could manifest themselves in various roleplaying ways, and you could even give your players an XP bonus for playing it properly.
SavageRobby said:
Thanks Savage.. that's a good point. It wouldn't necessarily affect battle that much, but it would be useful in the roleplaying aspect. On that note, couldn't you do that with any really low ability, just for fun/roleplaying? Anyone with 8 or 9 in a stat could choose a 'drawback' or 'trait' that they would acknowledge and try to remember to use as part of their personage. I know I can do that as the DM, but do you (or anyone else btw?) have any reason why that would be a bad idea?
Celebrim
Legend
1) Liberal use of skill checks.
Some suggestions:
a) Fighting on uneven, broken, or sloping terrain (ei you are distracted and can't take 10) requires a balance check. Even if this check is only DC 5, with armor check penalties and few skill points, it will come up a couple times that characters will stumble and/or fall.
b) Force them to make Appraise skill checks before you describe the loot. If they get thier appraise wrong, mis-describe the loot - ei they mistake brass for gold, silver or gold plating for sold silver, or vica versa describe something as junk when its actually valuable.
c) Enforce Knowledge checks to recognize monsters and hazards. Without successful checks, keep your descriptions deliberately vague to minimize the characters access to meta-game information.
d) Present them with puzzles which require a Knowledge checks to recieve clues.
e) Place them in a wilderness situation where skills like survival, swim, profession (boating), ride, and handle animal would be useful. For example, the dungeon where the macguffin is located is not easily accessible and a significant journey of many weeks must be undertaken to reach it.
f) Place them in an upper class social setting where skills like sense motive, knowledge (nobility), diplomacy, perform (dancing) and bluff would be useful. For example, to solve a crime that either has been committed or to prevent one that is about to be committed (or both).
g) Present them with a problem where inflitration by guile would be preferable to head long assaut, making bluff, disguise, speak language, move silently, hide and sleight of hand are useful. For example, the PC's could be assigned to acquire certain information from city which is hostile to the PC's own culture.
2) Require INT checks when the characters ask OOC for information given in the past (the name of a certain PC they've met for example).
3) Place them in positions where thier low intelligence causes a social penalty, such as interacting with scholars or other types that prize intelligence and judge people by same. Then penalize thier social skills under the circumstances accordingly.
4) Place them in situations where they must read languages other than common or interact with NPC's that don't know common.
Some suggestions:
a) Fighting on uneven, broken, or sloping terrain (ei you are distracted and can't take 10) requires a balance check. Even if this check is only DC 5, with armor check penalties and few skill points, it will come up a couple times that characters will stumble and/or fall.
b) Force them to make Appraise skill checks before you describe the loot. If they get thier appraise wrong, mis-describe the loot - ei they mistake brass for gold, silver or gold plating for sold silver, or vica versa describe something as junk when its actually valuable.
c) Enforce Knowledge checks to recognize monsters and hazards. Without successful checks, keep your descriptions deliberately vague to minimize the characters access to meta-game information.
d) Present them with puzzles which require a Knowledge checks to recieve clues.
e) Place them in a wilderness situation where skills like survival, swim, profession (boating), ride, and handle animal would be useful. For example, the dungeon where the macguffin is located is not easily accessible and a significant journey of many weeks must be undertaken to reach it.
f) Place them in an upper class social setting where skills like sense motive, knowledge (nobility), diplomacy, perform (dancing) and bluff would be useful. For example, to solve a crime that either has been committed or to prevent one that is about to be committed (or both).
g) Present them with a problem where inflitration by guile would be preferable to head long assaut, making bluff, disguise, speak language, move silently, hide and sleight of hand are useful. For example, the PC's could be assigned to acquire certain information from city which is hostile to the PC's own culture.
2) Require INT checks when the characters ask OOC for information given in the past (the name of a certain PC they've met for example).
3) Place them in positions where thier low intelligence causes a social penalty, such as interacting with scholars or other types that prize intelligence and judge people by same. Then penalize thier social skills under the circumstances accordingly.
4) Place them in situations where they must read languages other than common or interact with NPC's that don't know common.
SavageRobby
First Post
Dachande said:
We've done this before, and it works fine. The players have to buy in (as a DM I strongly suggest you don't assign them the characteristics - let the players figure them out as part of their character conception), but other than that, I've never seen any real problems. Little quirks like that do nothing but enrich gameplay, in my experience. You can even do it in the reverse, as well - have characters define their high ability scores.
There is an old niche game called Over the Edge that has you define your abilities and drawbacks in this manner. If you were strong, you might define it as "athletic", "brawny", "wiry" or whatever. A high Charisma? Could be "strong personality", "riveting public speaker", "captivating presence", etc.
QuaziquestGM
First Post
You might want to describe things differently to each character.
If they are attacked by a monster, describe the monster vaguely for everyone: Ungly with green skin.
Then after they fail the check to identify the monster, tell each of them what each thinks it is, and then narrate accordingly...
For each player's turn, briefly recap what just happened the turn before.
To Player 1: The big ork just hit you with his club....You swing your sword? Ok roll to hit.
To player 2: You buddy just hit the troll but you know the damage won't last long as it isn't fire or acid.....Burning hands? OK, roll damage. Hey, roll reflex save....
To player 3: Your wizard just set the fighter and the huge goblin on fire.....
If they are attacked by a monster, describe the monster vaguely for everyone: Ungly with green skin.
Then after they fail the check to identify the monster, tell each of them what each thinks it is, and then narrate accordingly...
For each player's turn, briefly recap what just happened the turn before.
To Player 1: The big ork just hit you with his club....You swing your sword? Ok roll to hit.
To player 2: You buddy just hit the troll but you know the damage won't last long as it isn't fire or acid.....Burning hands? OK, roll damage. Hey, roll reflex save....
To player 3: Your wizard just set the fighter and the huge goblin on fire.....
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