Critique this build: Bear Warrior

[Dagredhel]

The mechanics you use are from books that I don't own; also, I very much don't like flaw system mechanics where you "give up" stuff that you weren't planning on using to gain a benefit, often a nice one, in your specialty. For my characters I tend to prefer builds that minimize the use of alternative class features, if any at all.

It's possible that the lack of replies to your build has something to do with why I wasn't planning on responding: unfamiliar mechancis and un-preferred character creation philosophy.

Makes sense, and I appreciate the insights.

Much of my own motivation was to see what could be done from published products, so I did search high and low, and the result is admittedly a grab bag from many sources. My two general ideas going into it were to find a way to cobble together a viable unarmed combatant/grappler without going Monk and at the same time to come up with a Barbarian who wasn't based off of charging and two-handed power attacks, but wasn't terribly underpowered by comparison as a result.

I do understand the reaction; I often feel the same way about ToB:BoNS stuff myself.

 

[theredrobedwizard]

Is +3 HP really worth losing 10' move? I mean, really. I'd suggest taking the Lion Totem (Complete Champion) and just renaming it to "Cave Bear Totem" or something. Pounce > +3HP. Failing that, take the Bear Totem from CC instead of UA. It gives you Improved Grab.

-TRRW

 

[Felix]

My two general ideas going into it were to find a way to cobble together a viable unarmed combatant/grappler without going Monk and at the same time to come up with a Barbarian who wasn't based off of charging and two-handed power attacks

Well, shall I take a look at my books and see what we can come up with?

Certainly you'll want to close to grapple distance as quickly as possible, so I suggest keeping the Barbarian's Fast Movement.

You don't deal much damage hand to hand (1d3), but one of the best ways to increase average damage is to increase the damage bonus and leave the die alone; Str should be your highest score. Pursuant to this I'd have at least 4 Fighter levels to get Weapon Spec: Unarmed Strike.

That would mean you'd have to take Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike, and if it's not already RAW, I think it should be an easy sell to your DM to allow the Weapon Focus bonus to apply to grapple checks.​

If you multiclass Fighter and Barbarian, Will saves will be your weak spot. Iron Will is a must. Also, the Reaping Mauler PrC has two abilities tied to Wisdom; Wis should be your second prioritized score.

Fortitude saves will be your strong suit, as will hit points, so a high Con may not be necessary. As a Reaping Mauler you'll be in light armor, so you might want a good Dex; unfortunately you won't keep that Dex to AC bonus when you grapple, so it may not be necessary.

Neither Int nor Cha will be a priority.

As for feats, Improved Unarmed Strike, Weapon Focus and Weapon Spec: Unarmed Strike, Iron Will, Clever Wrestling should all be taken. Two Weapon Fighting as well because in a grapple, you may full attack with a series of grapple checks; your grappling ability should be stellar so a -2 to the check ought not matter so much. The more attacks you get means the more you'll be able to apply that damage bonus. TWF has a stat requirement, so it may be that you'd rather take some Ranger levels to get it; this would also gain you Favored Enemy, which will add to damage. I recommend Favored Enemy: Humans.

Be a Human and get that bonus feat, though you may consider being a Half-orc, delaying your feat progression, and getting a +2 Str. Possibly.

Round out your character with ranks in Intimidate to say, "If you don't put your weapons down, I'll break his neck!" Grappling the leader and being able to end the fight early may win out over being able to kill mooks one at a time.​

How's this look?

 

[Felix]

I should say that as a weaponless grappler, you should expect to fare very poorly indeed against a variety of foes. Then again, Rogues suffer the same problem, so this isn't necessarily damning.

 

[Dagredhel]

Is +3 HP really worth losing 10' move? I mean, really. I'd suggest taking the Lion Totem (Complete Champion) and just renaming it to "Cave Bear Totem" or something. Pounce > +3HP. Failing that, take the Bear Totem from CC instead of UA. It gives you Improved Grab.
-TRRW

"Unless noted otherwise," Improved Grab is only applicable to opponents one size smaller than you. The CC Bear Totem ability isn't "otherwise noted", so it isn't that great.

 

[Dagredhel]

If you consider those flaws trade-offs. Not really much of a trade-off when they're not your focus to begin with.

I'd imagine that nobody would select flaws that were truly detrimental to their primary focus. But they do further limit the character's options nonetheless.

 

[IanB]

If it was me, I'd want to push for the dire bear form ASAP. Not getting it until 20th level in most games is going to be almost the same as never getting it. YMMV.

 

[Dagredhel]

Well, shall I take a look at my books and see what we can come up with?

Yes, please.

Certainly you'll want to close to grapple distance as quickly as possible, so I suggest keeping the Barbarian's Fast Movement.

Actually, I wanted to go in the opposite direction from the stereotypical hard-charging Barbarian, so dropping Fast Movement was in keeping with the concept.

You don't deal much damage hand to hand (1d3), but one of the best ways to increase average damage is to increase the damage bonus and leave the die alone; Str should be your highest score. Pursuant to this I'd have at least 4 Fighter levels to get Weapon Spec: Unarmed Strike.

Superior Unarmed Strike improves on that base damage, and Rage adds to Strength. A Bear Warrior in bear form gets a hefty bonus: +8, +16, or +20, and Warshaper adds to both Strength and Constitution as well (another +4).

That would mean you'd have to take Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike, and if it's not already RAW, I think it should be an easy sell to your DM to allow the Weapon Focus bonus to apply to grapple checks.

I just couldn't resist another +4 to grapple checks while Raging.

If you multiclass Fighter and Barbarian, Will saves will be your weak spot. Iron Will is a must. Also, the Reaping Mauler PrC has two abilities tied to Wisdom; Wis should be your second prioritized score...

Steadfast Determination adds much more to Will saves for a character with a high Constitution already who piles on more bonuses when in preferred combat mode (Raging/bear form).

...As for feats, Improved Unarmed Strike, Weapon Focus and Weapon Spec: Unarmed Strike, Iron Will, Clever Wrestling should all be taken. Two Weapon Fighting as well because in a grapple, you may full attack with a series of grapple checks; your grappling ability should be stellar so a -2 to the check ought not matter so much. The more attacks you get means the more you'll be able to apply that damage bonus. TWF has a stat requirement, so it may be that you'd rather take some Ranger levels to get it; this would also gain you Favored Enemy, which will add to damage. I recommend Favored Enemy: Humans...

City Brawler provides the benefit of Improved Unarmed Strike and Two Weapon Fighting with unarmed strikes at 1st level. (This also helps to offset the lousy initial damage die. And the character can always his Longspear or another simple weapon.)

...Round out your character with ranks in Intimidate to say, "If you don't put your weapons down, I'll break his neck!" Grappling the leader and being able to end the fight early may win out over being able to kill mooks one at a time.

Agreed! Although... being able to grapple that BBEG with one arm (or paw) while attacking without penalty would be neat, and biting the poor schmucks face off would be... sweet.

...How's this look?

It looks like a solid build, but I wanted to de-emphasize the mobility, and the synergies between the variant Barbarian abilities, bear form and Warshaper just seemed like too much to pass up.

Thanks again, Felix. I appreciate it.

 

[Greybar]

Thanks for posting to my recent thread on a similar approach, I like what you've done here. I didn't know that gauntlets could be combined with unarmed strike - I thought they were considered a weapon, but I see that you're right. Also, doesn't Improved Unarmed Strike already make your damage lethal?

 

[Demoquin]

Yes the feat IUS does make his fist lethal or whatever else he decides to use as a an attack. Headbutt?


Looks really good. Where can i find the multi grab feat line and city brawler.