Larnievc
Hero
Yeah, there seemed to be loads of ‘barbarian X’ across the books.
The complete fighter was brilliant: the others less so.
D&D 5E Cross-classing Subclasses and Multiple subclasses
The complete fighter was brilliant: the others less so.
Larnievc
Hero
Background feats might work.
Arnwolf666
Adventurer
With enough effort and hard work we can make this game as complex as pathfinder.
TwoSix
Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer
We could only be so lucky.
Arnwolf666
Adventurer
I tease. I like both games quite a bit. I look forward to see how this can be implemented.
Esker
Hero
Yeah, I like it on customization grounds, but the subclass features tend to be somewhat front-loaded -- or, at least, enough of them are that this poses balance issues.
If I'm a wizard and I can take the level two features from bladesinger, diviner, and war mage, that's a considerably more powerful level 10 character than any one of those subclasses is by itself.
There's also the issue that some subclasses grant benefits in between subclass feature levels, while others don't: arcane trickster, eldritch knight, land druid, etc. all get spells and/or feature scaling, for example, in a way that isn't comparable to what other subclasses of rogue, fighter, and druid get.
If I'm a wizard and I can take the level two features from bladesinger, diviner, and war mage, that's a considerably more powerful level 10 character than any one of those subclasses is by itself.
There's also the issue that some subclasses grant benefits in between subclass feature levels, while others don't: arcane trickster, eldritch knight, land druid, etc. all get spells and/or feature scaling, for example, in a way that isn't comparable to what other subclasses of rogue, fighter, and druid get.
CleverNickName
Limit Break Dancing
I've never had a player ask for a subclass that wasn't part of his class, but I would probably allow it on a case-by-case basis. Certain combos wouldn't be an issue, but others might.
I don't think I would go for multiple subclasses, though. I'd prefer they go the multiclassing route, if only for the sake of simplicity.
I don't think I would go for multiple subclasses, though. I'd prefer they go the multiclassing route, if only for the sake of simplicity.
Tallifer
Hero
I think players should be allowed to cherry-pick among their class's subclass options at each level. Not sure why players should be forced to take a crappy subclass feature. If all players do this, everyone is equal. As for me as the dungeon master, I can easily adjust the encounters to match the party's power. But players enjoy good stuff.
Fanaelialae
Legend
I don't allow multi-pathing, as subclasses can sometimes be frontloaded. For example, being able to trade off the champion's athletics bonus for battlemaster manuevers is a superior choice.
However, I allow a feat that does allow having two subclasses. It's a bit complicated, but it's been taken once or twice in my games and the player enjoyed it without breaking the game (the one I recall was a Land Druid who picked up some features from Moon I think). I feel that a feat is a fair price, since cherry picking features can certainly be beneficial. I can't recall but I may have used a similar feat from somewhere as the basis for my version.
Prodigy
You are a master of two paths and your ability to think outside the box and innate affinity to your class has allowed you to learn to blend training from more than one subclass of your class. You gain the following benefits:
Let’s assume you are playing a Druid with this feat and select Circle of the Moon at 2nd level. You gain Combat Wild Shape and Circle Forms. Then, at 6th level, you choose Circle of the Land. You gain Land’s Stride and will gain the bonus spells at 7th and 9th level appropriate to the land type you chose. However, you are still limited to CR 1 beast shapes, since you have not reached 6th level as far as your Circle of the Moon features are concerned. At 10th level you take Circle of the Moon again and gain Elemental Wild Shape. Additionally, you can now assume the form of CR 2 beasts since you are effectively 6th level in the Circle of the Moon. At 13th level you gain the ability to become a CR 3 beast. At 14th level, if you choose Circle of the Land you gain Nature’s Sanctuary and your Wild Shape does not increase beyond CR 3. If you choose Circle of the Moon you gain Thousand Forms, and your Wild Shape CR increases to 4 at 16th level and 5 at 19th level.
As another example, a Fighter could choose to be both a Champion and Eldritch Knight. At 3rd level assume you choose Champion, gaining Improved Critical. At 7th level, you choose Eldritch Knight, gaining War Magic and Spellcasting. However, your spellcasting starts as per a 3rd level Eldritch Knight, because you were not an Eldritch Knight from levels 3-6, and therefore did not gain the benefits thereof. At 9th level, you will have the equivalent casting of a 5th level Eldritch Knight. Continuing on, at 10th level you take Champion, gaining Additional Fighting Style. Once again, because you are not an Eldritch Knight during this period, your Spellcasting will not improve from levels 10 to 14. At 15th level, you once again switch to Eldritch Knight, gaining Arcane Charge and improving your Spellcasting to the equivalent of a 6th level Eldritch Knight. At level 17, your Spellcasting will have improved to the equivalent of a level 8th level Eldritch Knight (allowing you to choose one spell from any school of magic, per your Spellcasting feature). If you choose Eldritch Knight at level 18, you gain Improved War Magic, and by 20th level you will be the equivalent of 11th level Eldritch Knight in Spellcasting ability. If you instead choose Champion at 18th level, you gain Survivor and your Spellcasting capabilities will remain the equivalent of an 8th level Eldritch Knight.
However, I allow a feat that does allow having two subclasses. It's a bit complicated, but it's been taken once or twice in my games and the player enjoyed it without breaking the game (the one I recall was a Land Druid who picked up some features from Moon I think). I feel that a feat is a fair price, since cherry picking features can certainly be beneficial. I can't recall but I may have used a similar feat from somewhere as the basis for my version.
Prodigy
You are a master of two paths and your ability to think outside the box and innate affinity to your class has allowed you to learn to blend training from more than one subclass of your class. You gain the following benefits:
- You gain proficiency in one additional skill or tool of your choice from your class list.
- Choose a second subclass from a class you already have levels in and that has more than one subclass. Doing so grants you the following benefits:
When you gain a new feature from your subclass after taking this feat, you may choose which of your subclasses to gain features from. (You do not gain the benefits of both.) You are considered to be of that subclass until the next level at which your subclass grants a feature (this pertains to abilities the subclass grants in between feature levels).
Let’s assume you are playing a Druid with this feat and select Circle of the Moon at 2nd level. You gain Combat Wild Shape and Circle Forms. Then, at 6th level, you choose Circle of the Land. You gain Land’s Stride and will gain the bonus spells at 7th and 9th level appropriate to the land type you chose. However, you are still limited to CR 1 beast shapes, since you have not reached 6th level as far as your Circle of the Moon features are concerned. At 10th level you take Circle of the Moon again and gain Elemental Wild Shape. Additionally, you can now assume the form of CR 2 beasts since you are effectively 6th level in the Circle of the Moon. At 13th level you gain the ability to become a CR 3 beast. At 14th level, if you choose Circle of the Land you gain Nature’s Sanctuary and your Wild Shape does not increase beyond CR 3. If you choose Circle of the Moon you gain Thousand Forms, and your Wild Shape CR increases to 4 at 16th level and 5 at 19th level.
As another example, a Fighter could choose to be both a Champion and Eldritch Knight. At 3rd level assume you choose Champion, gaining Improved Critical. At 7th level, you choose Eldritch Knight, gaining War Magic and Spellcasting. However, your spellcasting starts as per a 3rd level Eldritch Knight, because you were not an Eldritch Knight from levels 3-6, and therefore did not gain the benefits thereof. At 9th level, you will have the equivalent casting of a 5th level Eldritch Knight. Continuing on, at 10th level you take Champion, gaining Additional Fighting Style. Once again, because you are not an Eldritch Knight during this period, your Spellcasting will not improve from levels 10 to 14. At 15th level, you once again switch to Eldritch Knight, gaining Arcane Charge and improving your Spellcasting to the equivalent of a 6th level Eldritch Knight. At level 17, your Spellcasting will have improved to the equivalent of a level 8th level Eldritch Knight (allowing you to choose one spell from any school of magic, per your Spellcasting feature). If you choose Eldritch Knight at level 18, you gain Improved War Magic, and by 20th level you will be the equivalent of 11th level Eldritch Knight in Spellcasting ability. If you instead choose Champion at 18th level, you gain Survivor and your Spellcasting capabilities will remain the equivalent of an 8th level Eldritch Knight.
