cult of the dragon conversions

[freyar]

Excellent, Echohawk, thank you! Now I don't feel guilty adding plenty of attacks to the Wyvern Drake.

 

[freyar]

Here's a CR question: what level party do you think would be about right to face a poison like this, delivered by a melee attack with a +21 attack bonus?

Poison (Ex): Injury, Fortitude DC25 (DC 10+1/2 racial HD+Con modifier+2 Ability Focus), initial damage death, secondary damage 2d6 Con.

 

[freyar]

I'm starting to think that this may be a bit tough, so I think I'll drop ability focus for some other combat feat and write the combat tactics to avoid using the sting right away. (The low number of hp might help with that). Then I'll peg the CR around 13-14 and bump up the breath weapon a bit. Might not be quite perfectly balanced, but whatever. Anyone care to jump in?

 

[Echohawk]

I have absolutely no experience whatsoever eyeballing CRs, so I'm a bit reluctant to jump in. That said, that's a very potent poison -- essentially a save or die effect usable every round, with the requirement for a successful melee attack lessening the potency a little. And the secondary damage is also pretty rough, although at 13/14th level I'd expect a PC party to have some way of dealing with the Con damage quickly enough for it to not be a complete disaster.

Still now that I look at a vanilla wyvern (CR6), I see it has 2d6 Con as both a primary and secondary damage (albeit with a much lower melee attack), so maybe the wyvern drake's poison isn't that out of line for CR 13-14.

Also, I should note that I had an extremely snake-infested day today. At lunch we had to chase a Mozambican spitting cobra out of the courtyard. Shortly afterwards my partner encountered a 7ft+ black mamba in the workshop, and only minutes later we had to calm down a plumber who discovered another (much smaller) mamba sitting in a tree within an arm's reach of his head.

So perhaps I'm unduly sensitive when it comes to poisonous things right now

 

[freyar]

I have absolutely no experience whatsoever eyeballing CRs, so I'm a bit reluctant to jump in. That said, that's a very potent poison -- essentially a save or die effect usable every round, with the requirement for a successful melee attack lessening the potency a little. And the secondary damage is also pretty rough, although at 13/14th level I'd expect a PC party to have some way of dealing with the Con damage quickly enough for it to not be a complete disaster.

Still now that I look at a vanilla wyvern (CR6), I see it has 2d6 Con as both a primary and secondary damage (albeit with a much lower melee attack), so maybe the wyvern drake's poison isn't that out of line for CR 13-14.

I'm not so much worried about killing a PC or two, since I expect that even raising someone isn't too big of a deal for a party of that level. Mostly I want to avoid instant TPKs. I don't have really any experience at that level, either, so I'm just not sure. If it's going to kill someone with a good fort save, like the fighter, more than 50% of the time, I'd be awfully worried. I've looked up a few NPCs on various web sites to check fort saves at different levels, but I think I'll try to find some more. Maybe just take a look at the NPC tables in the DMG. In a way, the low HD of this thing might make it less of a problem, because it can't afford to be too close to the party too many rounds before getting walloped.

Also, I should note that I had an extremely snake-infested day today. At lunch we had to chase a Mozambican spitting cobra out of the courtyard. Shortly afterwards my partner encountered a 7ft+ black mamba in the workshop, and only minutes later we had to calm down a plumber who discovered another (much smaller) mamba sitting in a tree within an arm's reach of his head.

So perhaps I'm unduly sensitive when it comes to poisonous things right now

Youch! I used to have a summer camp job which involved dealing with poisonous snakes every so often (well, non-poisonous ones, too). I can still remember the first time I had to go catch a snake, which was a fairly agitated rattlesnake. Not quite so deadly as a cobra or mamba, though.

 

[Echohawk]

Not quite so deadly as a cobra or mamba, though.

Things I have learned today:

• A black mamba bite can cause death in 20 minutes and is always fatal without rapid medical attention.
• Dying from a mamba bite is apparently a fairly pleasant way to go, feeling rather like being drunk.
• Black mambas are the fastest moving snake on the planet, reaching speeds of up to 20 km/h.
• If you do encounter a black mamba, you should make no sudden movements, you should not turn your back to it, and if it moves towards you, that probably means that you are between it and its lair and you should move orthogonally away. Presumably while still not making any sudden movements and trying to forget the bit about them being the fastest moving snake on Earth.

Say, if any of you are ever in this part of the world, feel free to look me up. We have a spare room

 

[freyar]

Things I have learned today:

• A black mamba bite can cause death in 20 minutes and is always fatal without rapid medical attention.
• Dying from a mamba bite is apparently a fairly pleasant way to go, feeling rather like being drunk.
• Black mambas are the fastest moving snake on the planet, reaching speeds of up to 20 km/h.
• If you do encounter a black mamba, you should make no sudden movements, you should not turn your back to it, and if it moves towards you, that probably means that you are between it and its lair and you should move orthogonally away. Presumably while still not making any sudden movements and trying to forget the bit about them being the fastest moving snake on Earth.

Say, if any of you are ever in this part of the world, feel free to look me up. We have a spare room

Ouch. Keep me away from them! OTOH, a rattlesnake bite can take a week or so to kill you, with several days to get medical attention. Meanwhile, it causes incredible swelling that can actually make your skin burst. I hear that it's quite painful. However, the fact that I've met several people who've survived rattler bites means they can't be that scary.

Anyway, on topic, I looked through some of the CR12-15 beasties in the ToH tonight. I don't feel so bad putting a DC 23 or 25 save-or-die at that CR now.

 

[freyar]

wyvern drake done

Echohawk, since you're keeping count, I've put the wyvern drake up in the PDF file on my homepage. It's going into homebrews soon, too.

 

[Echohawk]

Added to the index

 

[freyar]

dracohydra

Ok, I will be working on the dracohydra next, which is just a 3.5 update from BOZ's 3e version, which is available here. All that I see missing is the class skills. Another point is that the hydra in 3.5 has fast healing 10+ number of heads. Should the dracohydra therefore also get fast healing with a slight bump in CR? Any comments?