D&D 5E D&D compared to Bespoke Genre TTRPGs

[jmartkdr2]

Thank you for the detailed response!

Interesting. What is the difference in the granularity between Stress and Consequences, if there is one. Is it possible to improve one or both? If so, how much?

Skills and stunts sound interesting, Aspects less so, but I get it.

I can get behind that.

OK, I knew I didn't like the sound of Aspects. Not really my style, but I am sure it works for some. Interestingly it is very similar to a mechanic I am developing called Authority (and similar to other Hero Point mechanics). It is for an Immortals 5e game. This type of mechanic makes sense for god to me, not so much for mortals. But we all like different things.

I like the golden rule, but not the example provided. Is that an actual rule or just an example you made up? I mean I can think of many ways to injury a armored person with my bare hands. I assume this doesn't apply to creatures with claws, teeth, and such.

Personally not a fan of such mechanics, but it seems easily hackable

I'm not following this, but I am sure it would make sense if I really knew the rules!

We have very simple armor with DR rules (AC still applies) that work well for us (and can even benefit the fighter). But we also have simple rules for spike damage (just trade extra attack for extra damage)!


Well that is your definition. For me it would be closer too: how quickly can we make the game more fun for our group.

I'mma but in and say: Fate is a really cool game that does what it does very well. I highly recommend you snag a copy and read through it. Even if you never play the game, there's a lot of good ideas to steal for other games.

Fate Accelerated (my preference) has an MSRP of $5 printed.

 

[Umbran]

OK, I knew I didn't like the sound of Aspects. Not really my style, but I am sure it works for some. Interestingly it is very similar to a mechanic I am developing called Authority (and similar to other Hero Point mechanics). It is for an Immortals 5e game. This type of mechanic makes sense for god to me, not so much for mortals. But we all like different things.

So, here's where we get to the nuance...

There doesn't have to be anything godlike about Aspects. At all. For example, "Professional Heavyweight Boxer" is a perfectly acceptable Aspect. Nothing godlike is going to come from that. A +2 on punching someone (which the dice will yield -4 to +4), or a reroll on a crappy result, is a typical thing.

In a Space 1889 Fate game I'm playing in, I have a character with an Aspect "Former Master Sergeant in Her Majesty's Service". It is less godlike, and more catch-all of professional experience. Note that I have to spend resources to use it. So, not very godlike at all.

 

[Umbran]

I'mma but in and say: Fate is a really cool game that does what it does very well. I highly recommend you snag a copy and read through it. Even if you never play the game, there's a lot of good ideas to steal for other games.

Fate Accelerated (my preference) has an MSRP of $5 printed.

You don't even need to buy it! The SRDs are available and, unlike some, totally useable in play.

The official Fate SRD

fate-srd.com

 

[Neonchameleon]

My most recent supers game I've acquired recognized this, and takes death off the table unless the player wants it.

My favourite death rule comes from Tenra Bansho Zero where you get bonuses if you put first serious injury then death on the line, declaring "Here I stand".

Thank you for the detailed response!

Interesting. What is the difference in the granularity between Stress and Consequences, if there is one. Is it possible to improve one or both? If so, how much?

Stress is more or less the equivalent of hit points. It's almost consequence free and relatively easy to recover. Consequences are actual consequences and both help people opposing you and get in your way. You take them if you can't take stress.

I'm not following this, but I am sure it would make sense if I really knew the rules!

The Fate SRD might be worth a read. Fate Core or Accelerated are good. And for that matter so is Dresden Files Accelerated, and the time travelling Fate of Cthulhu.

 

[Neonchameleon]

That's because 3 is barely any DR, of course it doesn't make any significant difference. Like, 6 damage or 3 damage, who cares. Even DR5, on the other hand, is more significant, and something like DR10 is debilitating for a fighter and just annoying for a rogue.

Heavy Armour Master is a hordebreaker feat. Anything intelligent of CR 1/2 or less or animals CR 1/4 or less are simply going to bounce off you despite bounded accuracy. Anything of CR 2 or more is going to ignore it.

 

[Imaro]

Yes, we you don't get guarantees on most things in life, so that's not a terribly strong argument.

Neither is the argument that it was played by a ton of other people when it comes to only caring about my particular table as opposed to mass market appeal.

When we want to stop talking about absolutes implied by "guarantees" and want to start talking about levels of confidence, then maybe this becomes productive.

Well having known and played various iterations of D&D with my specific group for years and done my fair share of hacking, adding and subtracting around it's current rules for said group, again for years... My level of confidence is pretty high that I can adapt and add to D&D in a manner that will provide enjoyment for them.

 

[Umbran]

Interesting. What is the difference in the granularity between Stress and Consequences, if there is one. Is it possible to improve one or both? If so, how much?

There are several variants, so it depends...

In Fate Core, everyone has two physical, and two mental stress boxes, and three consequence slots (Mild, Moderate, and Severe, which can soak up 2, 4, and 6 stress, respectively) You can increase either by buying skills (Physique and Will), or taking certain Stunts.

Adding in extras (more stress boxes, or even like, say, having a Financial Stress track, or whatever) is super-easy.

I like the golden rule, but not the example provided. Is that an actual rule or just an example you made up? I mean I can think of many ways to injury a armored person with my bare hands. I assume this doesn't apply to creatures with claws, teeth, and such.

The Gold and Silver rules of Fate are:

"Decide what you’re trying to accomplish first, then consult the rules to help you do it."
and
"Never let the rules get in the way of what makes narrative sense."

So, narratively, it probably doesn't make sense for an untrained, unarmed peasant to inflict a lot of harm on an armored knight. So... you don't bother rolling dice, even if the rules technically say that if the peasant attacks you should roll dice. It may make sense that another knight, who happens to not have armor and weapons on at the time, might still be able to hurt another knight....

What makes sense is genre-dependent. Gritty noir is not Knights of the Round Table is not superheroes, and so on.

 

[Umbran]

Well having known and played various iterations of D&D with my specific group for years and done my fair share of hacking, adding and subtracting around it's current rules for said group, again for years... My level of confidence is pretty high that I can adapt and add to D&D in a manner that will provide enjoyment for them.

Awesome. So... what's the problem, then?

Go, make some rules for your players, and have fun.

Look, the point about using a game that's designed to deliver some particular experience is ADVICE. If you are Super-Duper-GM-Designer-Man, you can ignore the advice. But then, if you are Super-Duper-GM-Designer-Man, you probably didn't ask for advice, so... what's the problem, exactly?

There is no particular reason to spend an ounce of energy on trying to disprove the advice, bcause it is advice, not a logical truism. "Oh, well, you told someone they should try another game, and I think you are totally wrong, nobody should ever have to do anything other than hack D&D to their will!" is not a path to a constructive discussion.

 

[dave2008]

So, here's where we get to the nuance...

There doesn't have to be anything godlike about Aspects. At all. For example, "Professional Heavyweight Boxer" is a perfectly acceptable Aspect. Nothing godlike is going to come from that. A +2 on punching someone (which the dice will yield -4 to +4), or a reroll on a crappy result, is a typical thing.

In a Space 1889 Fate game I'm playing in, I have a character with an Aspect "Former Master Sergeant in Her Majesty's Service". It is less godlike, and more catch-all of professional experience. Note that I have to spend resources to use it. So, not very godlike at all.

OK, that sounds similar to backgrounds and my preferred method for skills.

I also created I misunderstanding by what you interpreted as "godlike," but I don't think it is relevant to take the time to explain it more. You've explained Aspects and that is what was needed.

 

[dave2008]

The Gold and Silver rules of Fate are:

"Decide what you’re trying to accomplish first, then consult the rules to help you do it."
and
"Never let the rules get in the way of what makes narrative sense."

OK, so basically how I play any RPG I've ever played. Well that certainly seems like a Golden Rule to me!