D&D Solos - just not that threatening

[SlyFlourish]

I may just try using solos 4 levels above the level of the party for a true solo fight.

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one having this problem.

 

[Markn]

This actually is not a good idea mshea. You will likely get into a major grind, long, boring fight.

 

[D'karr]

I may just try using solos 4 levels above the level of the party for a true solo fight.

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one having this problem.

This IS the way to make solos more challenging. However, if all you do is throw a solo you will end with a very grindy combat.

If you do not include some interesting terrain and effects to a combat with a solo four levels higher than the party, it will be boring, and frustrating. Take a look at the Black Dragon solo from the preview adventure SCALEGLOOM HALL, and you'll see what I mean.

I have found that including solos of the same level or lower level than the party, and adding some additional creatures, terrain, or effects works much better than a higher level solo.

 

[fba827]

Yeah - from both a player and DM perspective, I find solos generally (not always, but generally) boring. So I often opt for elites with a tough group, or a solo of PC-equal level (or even level -1) along with a group of weak accomplises.

 

[keterys]

There's certain things you can do to make an encounter more interesting and have it still seem like the solo is doing it... two example solo combats I put together:

1) A dragon fight I divided into roughly 4 quarters, with the expectation that the first quarter would go very quick - at first, the dragon is overconfident and barrels right in trying to smash them down as quickly as possible like gnats. Once it feels threatened, it begins to use its cavern intelligently moving between pools of acid to keep its distance and fountain the pools up at those who try to get close. When it's bloodied it roars in pain and the stalactites along the top of the cavern begin to fall down, finally when reduced to 1/4 life it utters a curse against the party and its blood and the acid pools combine into minions that attack the party. The separate elements are the acid pools, collapsing cavern trap, and the minions, and the solo's level is actually a lot closer to the party's.

2) A giant ape in a jungle setting is stampeded towards the party. At first, a stream of minion beasts are panicked and blunder into the party potentially creating havoc and may be killed or Nature-d away, then the giant ape shows up and it smashes into them, occasionally leaping away onto a tree to move the combat. It also hurls boulders and flattens trees, knocking them over and among them, and once bloodied will do earthquake-like actions as well.

The important thing is not to have things like purple worms. Booooring.

 

[Evilhalfling]

in H2: my party had a blast, for a while. The dragon was hit by a staggering assault early, they had a lot of fun maneuvering the dragon and themselves around the hazards. The poison was not a factor, due to earlier successes.

The tactically worst player got trapped in a corner and nearly killed but other players were virtually untouched.
The encounter did go too long because I disregarded the time limit and fought to the death.

solo fights need more than just bloodied powers, really they need a major change at about 1/2 bloodied hp as well. By then the PCs have gotten in a groove, and burned out all their big powers. The last quarter hp is a slow drag.

 

[SlyFlourish]

I've been playing in the paragon tier now for about three adventures and so far I've barely bloodied the party with some fights I thought were tough.

I just want to drop a party member again.

Ok, so level +4 solos are a bad idea and level = solos are better with extra guys who make up for it - got it.

Still, in Trollhaunt, they have more than a few fights with just solos.

 

[Mithreinmaethor]

I've been playing in the paragon tier now for about three adventures and so far I've barely bloodied the party with some fights I thought were tough.

I just want to drop a party member again.

Ok, so level +4 solos are a bad idea and level = solos are better with extra guys who make up for it - got it.

Still, in Trollhaunt, they have more than a few fights with just solos.

I have read that encounter that you have referenced. How did they do with the other 5 monsters in the room ? And how did they handle the zone that slowed and possibly immobilized them? And the quasi-trap that attacks any non-dragon in the room?

You should have easily bloodied people in that encounter.

 

[Wraith Form]

Solos play like complicated PCs. They have a lot of little tricks that work together. If you forget one thing, they suck. If you don't forget, you might kill the party.

This, in my view, indicates "something is wrong". Further, I keep seeing posts where DMs indicate they either have their players walking all over the opponents or that they're TPKing them all the dang time.

I, as a DM (and a new DM to D&D4, for that matter), am not a tactical thinker, and I also tend to become forgetful in the chaos that is combat. This makes me concerned that, as time goes on, combat will continue to be boring (as it's been for my group just like the OP was saying)...grindy swingfests that take an hour of yawning to complete.

 

[chaotix42]

I take back what I said about the fomorian - that dude is nasty! I pitted my PCs against one along with a few cyclops minions, a quickling zephyr (who started the battle hidden in the fomorian's pocket), and a few rakshasas and the fomorian lived till the end, putting more of a hurt on the dwarf fighter than I think he's ever felt before!

I think we should change the thread to "D&D Minions - just not that threatening." lol