D&D General D&Difying History

[Morrus]

I don't know any Saxons. And frankly neither does anyone else, because they are a defunct culture that was subsumed into a number of modern cultures. Spoiler: picts aren't scots, either.

Frankly I'm a little surprised to see you respond this way.

Frankly, I’m a little surprised that you’re surprised. Surprise!

 

[Micah Sweet]

Well, let's unpack it.
A lot of what's going on in non-human race descriptions in D&D come from objections of using the same kinds of dehumanizing descriptions as have been used historically to dehumanize other races. There is no literal analog between those non-human D&D races and actual real-world races - just a similarity in description (brutish, savage, primitive, etc).

But the idea of making a historically campaign in which the role of a human culture, one that may have been assimilated into an amalgam culture but still has living descendants, is replaced with orcs or hobgoblins or elves or whatever is literally dehumanizing them within the context of your campaign.

I'm not saying that you're not free to reimagine history any way you want. But you probably shouldn't be surprised at Morrus's response.

Of course, that means the only choice is to not use nonhuman heritages at all in that game.

 

[billd91]

Of course, that means the only choice is to not use nonhuman heritages at all in that game.

Or don’t use them as a whole replacement for a historical culture. Can you have orcs and dwarves among human Saxons and participating in Saxon culture? You sure could without dehumanizing the Saxons. You can also have them as separate enclaves with their own game-unique cultures in historical geography by adding them to the human cultures present and that would also be without dehumanizing any human cultures.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Or don’t use them as a whole replacement for a historical culture. Can you have orcs and dwarves among human Saxons and participating in Saxon culture? You sure could without dehumanizing the Saxons. You can also have them as separate enclaves with their own game-unique cultures in historical geography by adding them to the human cultures present and that would also be without dehumanizing any human cultures.

So all cultures become eclectic mixes of different heritages? That is one way to go. Your other suggestion is better, but it does mean that your historical cultures are going to need to accommodate several new neighbors.

 

[billd91]

So all cultures become eclectic mixes of different heritages?

Real human cultures are pretty much always that all the time anyway.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Real human cultures are pretty much always that all the time anyway.

Often, but nonhuman races have biological differences. It doesn't always work.

 

[TheSword]

One potentially interesting idea would be to take a point or fact from history that you find interesting. Confound it, and explain why historians hundreds of years later have got the wrong idea.

It’s obviously a fantasy equivalent but we see this a lot in the Witcher series of books. A fairytale that we know IRL is found to be a misunderstanding of actual events in the story.

For instance perhaps Hadrian’s Wall isn’t there for the reasons we thought it was. It’s a barrier stopping the magic of an ice queen. Or maybe the Danes were leaving Denmark not because population growth but because of some horrendous creature, or dark cult. Why did the Druids commit human sacrifice and evil what were the Beltane fire really for.

Even if you want to take the magic out, you could have plausible reasons that nevertheless would confound modern historians.

 

[Tonguez]

So all cultures become eclectic mixes of different heritages? That is one way to go. Your other suggestion is better, but it does mean that your historical cultures are going to need to accommodate several new neighbors.

Historic cultures alreadydid that for us - thats why the Germanic dwarfs live under the mountains, Elfs live in the Fae realm and little folk stay hidden in the deep forest. Goliath was from a family of giants recruited by the Phillistine army. Lots of Ogres living in castles in France too. And who knows how many Shifters, Tieflings, Dhampirs, Haglings, or other human passing creatures lived among the humans of Europe

 

[BookTenTiger]

One potentially interesting idea would be to take a point or fact from history that you find interesting. Confound it, and explain why historians hundreds of years later have got the wrong idea.

It’s obviously a fantasy equivalent but we see this a lot in the Witcher series of books. A fairytale that we know IRL is found to be a misunderstanding of actual events in the story.

For instance perhaps Hadrian’s Wall isn’t there for the reasons we thought it was. It’s a barrier stopping the magic of an ice queen. Or maybe the Danes were leaving Denmark not because population growth but because of some horrendous creature, or dark cult. Why did the Druids commit human sacrifice and evil what were the Beltane fire really for.

Even if you want to take the magic out, you could have plausible reasons that nevertheless would confound modern historians.

This reminds me of a Dresden Files game I played in set in San Francisco. It was fun to take the quirks and history of SF and come up with magical explanations. For example, south of San Francisco is a town called Colma that is full of graveyards. In real history, real estate was such a premium in San Francisco that they dug up most of the graveyards and moved them down to Colma. In our game, Colma provided a magical barrier between SF and the South Bay. San Francisco is surrounded on three sides by water; Colma, with its many protective souls, provided the final barrier.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Historic cultures alreadydid that for us - thats why the Germanic dwarfs live under the mountains, Elfs live in the Fae realm and little folk stay hidden in the deep forest. Goliath was from a family of giants recruited by the Phillistine army. Lots of Ogres living in castles in France too. And who knows how many Shifters, Tieflings, Dhampirs, Haglings, or other human passing creatures lived among the humans of Europe

But those races wouldn't be PCs in that world, at least not in a way that lets them easily interface with human cultures.