D&D General D&D's Utter Dominance Is Good or Bad Because...

[Hussar]

WotC relying on whatever small subset of fans respond to surveys to make design decisions is a bad way to design a game

See, this is the point I disagree with though. "Small subset"? Wasn't there like 80 000 responses to the last UA? That's not a "small subset". There is no cabal forcing design decisions.

 

[mamba]

I'd say the frequent "I can't find anyone to play anything but 5e" is evidence. Its not overwhelming, but it doesn't exactly suggest the expansion has spilled out to other games in a significant way.

D&D is about 50% of the market from my understanding, not 95, so it should be as easy to find players for something else as for D&D. Of course if you insist on playing with your friends or a specific other game, things become more difficult…

Either way, that is just anecdotal

The question is what percentage is "some".

No, the question is would more people have picked up that other TTRPG if D&D did not exist, or not. Unless it were more, D&D bringing people in is helping

 

[mamba]

Even publishers of long established RPG IP’s from the 80’s-90’s like Vampire, Shadowrun, and Cyberpunk go to Kickstarter now.

that does not mean they could not produce it without KS, only that it is smarter to do so with it

 

[mamba]

That's true to some extent, but all evidence I have is that WOTC has been very resistant to selling their core line in PDF form, and that means to buy and not use has a much higher overhead.

overhead as in shelf space? Because it is not more expensive... I can regularly find the D&D printed books for less than they cost on Beyond (and if I am ok with reading a PDF, Beyond might do as well...)

 

[mamba]

Then you don't, but I'm not going to give any credit to a premise that appears ludicrous on the face of it.

I feel the same way, which is why I am dismissing yours

 

[Hussar]

I am not sure I understand this part… so you were thrown under the bus by 5e and want something else?

Oh, absolutely. I was a 4e fan. I got launched under the bus and then they did donuts on top of me for years. You couldn't even suggest elements from 4e without getting pilloried and any time you point to anything that does come from 4e, it's automatically shouted down as not really coming from 4e.

I went with 5e because it's a good game. I enjoy 5e. But, I also enjoy 4e. I would love to see more 4e elements brought forward, but, I know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that that will absolutely not be allowed to happen.

 

[MGibster]

I want to play! I want to play!

Pro: D&D serves as a lingua franca for gamers. If I'm explaining a new game to a person, I can almost always compare it to D&D to help them understand the rules. And just to be clear, these comparisons aren't negative.

Con: The TTRPG industry (however we want to define industry) revolves around D&D to the point where several businesses are hurt by decisions WotC makes. i.e. They're beholden to a product they ultimately have no control over.

 

[Reynard]

See, this is the point I disagree with though. "Small subset"? Wasn't there like 80 000 responses to the last UA? That's not a "small subset". There is no cabal forcing design decisions.

Stop saying "cabal." No one has used that term and weaponized it's implications but you.

80K is what percent of 30 million?

All I am saying is that the people most likely to engage in the playtest and surveys are the ones most likely to hold strong opinions about the design of D&D. I'm saying, quite directly, that the designers should ignore these people. They should the design the game the way they intend and then sell it.

Half assed playtests that don't actually present complete rules don't produce useful feedback. It invites loud minority opinions to shape the game. It's a bad idea.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Well, you may be underestimating the pull WotC has on some folks to buy new books they publish, with the best of intentions to use them or just to read. I just don't think that most of those adventure paths purchased from WotC were actually used to run the adventure. At best they assisted in someone's homebrew, or were put out on a shelf because the buyer is totally going to run them, "some day".

Its impossible to understate brand loyalty in some people with this sort of thing, so with a subset you're probably right. The question is how big that group is.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Well you claiming that even though the number of non-D&D games doesn't change it would somehow make it easier to find those games if there were no D&D is illogical so there you go. If there are 5 non-D&D games in your area with or without D&D, nothing changes.

Take a set of cups.

Have 5 of them be various colors, and 50 of them be red.

Have 5 of them be various colors, and 10 of them be red.

Have some in a hurry toss a marble in a cup.

See how many marbles land in the varied colored cups in each case.

If you don't see the parallel I'm suggesting, you don't.