Damage Reduction

[Kevin O'Reilly]

OK - I don't have any 3.5 books, and I'm going on heresay and posts on the board.

I'm getting confused over some of the DR stories I'm hearing like

Mantle of Faith DR5/evil ...
Demon DR10/good ...

So, I thought that the item following "/" represented how you by passed the DR.

So, shouldn't Mantle be DR5/good (i.e. the robe has no effect against prople of similiar faiths) and Demon DR/10 evil, representing that there is no protection from treachery within.. or such like.

Help, please help

 

[gfunk]

So, I thought that the item following "/" represented how you by passed the DR.

So, shouldn't Mantle be DR5/good (i.e. the robe has no effect against prople of similiar faiths) and Demon DR/10 evil, representing that there is no protection from treachery within.. or such like.

You are exactly right, but you must be confused by the semantics.

If a demon has DR 10/good, it means that you subtract 10 hp of damage from physical attacks except if the weapon is good. In that case, DR is bypassed.

So if a PC with a "good" (holy) weapon or a celestial (good subtype) were attacking a demon, DR would be circumvented.

If a Demon had 10/Evil DR it would be backwards!

 

[Philip]

So, shouldn't Mantle be DR5/good (i.e. the robe has no effect against prople of similiar faiths) and Demon DR/10 evil, representing that there is no protection from treachery within.. or such like.

I think its more like, fight fire with water not with more fire. You can hurt a creature with something that is abhors or reviles. Silver vs. lycanthropes, cold iron vs. fey, good vs. evil and evil vs. good.

 

[Kevin O'Reilly]

I understand the mechanic, I'm questioning the semantics of DR being bypassed by the most common enemy.

A mantle designed to help the pious should not be overcome by the very thing it was designed to defeat.

It's like a Paladin having DR5/evil... what would the point be? Surely the DR should only be passed by someone of pure spirit - ala Exaclibur.

The demon thing.. OK, I can see that good should penetrate the DR....

 

[Staffan]

Symmetry. The Mantle is supposedly possessed of holy power, but a strong enough unholy power can negate that protection and hurt the one protected by it. The same applies to demons - the purity of a good-aligned weapon is too much for their supernatural protections to handle.

Though I also understand that many of the higher-level outsiders will require both aligned weapons and the correct material to penetrate DR - in order to hurt a pit fiend, a "merely" good weapon won't help. It must be good *and* made of silver.

 

[DreamChaser]

I understand the mechanic, I'm questioning the semantics of DR being bypassed by the most common enemy.

Reasoning not semantics. Of course, my saying this IS just semantics.


It is a concept of conflicting energies not of most common enemy. If an item were designed to protect the good faithful from evil creatures it would not offer DR it would offer protection from evil or magic circle vs evil.

Plus, it is an archetype thing. If each side were able to make things that protected them completely from each other, the great war between G/E would become meaningless. The two must always be able to do battle and only the most holy can harm the most profane and vice versa.

DC

 

[Kevin O'Reilly]

OK, convinced

Thanks everyone.

 

[Paladin]

Demons vs. Devils

I may have missed something, but with the new DR in place, does that mean the Blood War just became an eternal boxing match?

If it takes a Good AND Lawful weapon to overcome a Tanari's DR, and a Good AND Chaotic weapon to overcome a Baatezu's DR - then how do they hurt each other effectively?

If their DR's are Good OR Lawful and Good OR Chaotic respectively, okay, they can kick each other all over the planes. If not, then those Blood War battles lasting so long finally makes sense I guess...

 

[hong]

Re: Demons vs. Devils

I may have missed something, but with the new DR in place, does that mean the Blood War just became an eternal boxing match?

What Blood War? Ain't no steenkin' Blood War in the core rules!

 

[Staffan]

Re: Demons vs. Devils

I may have missed something, but with the new DR in place, does that mean the Blood War just became an eternal boxing match?

If it takes a Good AND Lawful weapon to overcome a Tanari's DR, and a Good AND Chaotic weapon to overcome a Baatezu's DR - then how do they hurt each other effectively?

Judging by the stuff in the conversion book, demons will likely have one of these DR negators: "good or cold iron", "good", or "good and cold iron". In other words, Lawful doesn't enter into it.

Also, don't forget that DR values in general are going down. The Barbed Devil, for example, has DR 10/good and inflicts a damage of 2d8+6. Assuming that their opposite numbers on the Abyssal side of things have similar values, they can still hurt one another (2d8-4 does up to 12 points of damage, with an average of 5-6 or so). On the higher scale of things, the Titan (DR 15/lawful) might not be able to penetrate its own DR, but with a damage of 4d6+27 those 15 points per attack are pretty much just a speedbump.