Dashing Swordsman feat

[Darklone]

I'm looking for a multiclass feat that combines Swashbuckler and Bard...

Edited now:

DASHING SWORDSMAN[GENERAL]
prerequs: Swashbuckler level 3, Bardic Music.
Benefits: Bard and Swashbuckler levels stack for Inspire Courage effects, Grace and Dodge bonuses as well as Bardic Knowledge. No Multiclass penalties. Swashbucklers Insightful strike works with CHA instead of INT.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Hmmm...so your Swashbuckler takes 1 level in Bard and this feat and then goes back to Swashbuckler, losing 1 BAB and a tad of HP to gain skill points, minor Bardic Knowledge, worthless cantrips that we'll immediately ignore, and then all the Bard songs? I think that may be a bit much. How about having it stack for just Inspire Courage, rather than giving all the songs out? That's still a big benefit (since Inspire Courage is usually the best one anyway), but it lets the single-class Bard keep something special over the Bard1/SwaX with the feat.

 

[Nifft]

I'm looking for a multiclass feat that combines Swashbuckler and Bard...

DASHING SWORDSMAN[GENERAL]
prerequs: Grace +1, Bardic Music.
Benefits: Bard and Swashbuckler levels stack for bardic music, Grace and Dodge bonuses. No Multiclass penalties.

Comments? Too weak, too strong?

Pretty weak... unless you mean that Bard and Swashbuckler levels both count as Bard levels (not just for daily uses, but for what effects you can generate and how effective your effects are). In which case, it's basically a feat to add Bardic Music to the Swashbuckler, which is not weak at all.

The Grace and Dodge bonuses are generally regarded as weak.

HOWEVER... and I'm not sure if this is too strong... allowing a level 3 Swashbuckler with Bardic Music to add his Charisma to damage might be more in the flavor of the class feat name. Maybe require that he be using Bardic Music and maintaining it with witty interjections (as a Move action every round) to gain this benefit, so he'd only be making single attacks. Maybe tie it in with Improved Feint (when you feint as a move action, if your next attack hits, add your Cha to the damage roll).

But I think these two classes DO need to have a conjoining feat, because they go so well together.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Darklone]

Two answers, one too strong, one too weak... Interesting balance problem, I'd say and perhaps the reason why there's no such feat yet.

Cha to damage ... don't like the style. And it doesn't fit the usual multiclass feats. ... Duh, you mean Cha to damage instead of the Swashies Int to damage? Hmm. Logic aside, this sounds good. Then added levels for the Inspire Courage ability and the Bardic Knowledge...

Now that sounds good to me. Though a TWF bard might rock like hell with Cha to damage... in addition to strength.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Two answers, one too strong, one too weak... Interesting balance problem, I'd say and perhaps the reason why there's no such feat yet.

Cha to damage ... don't like the style. And it doesn't fit the usual multiclass feats. ... Duh, you mean Cha to damage instead of the Swashies Int to damage? Hmm. Logic aside, this sounds good. Then added levels for the Inspire Courage ability and the Bardic Knowledge...

Now that sounds good to me. Though a TWF bard might rock like hell with Cha to damage... in addition to strength.

By the way, the main reason Nifft and I gave different answers is that we have differing interpretations of what your feat does--note that he points out that the feat is extremely strong if it does what I think it does

 

[Darklone]

Right... thanks for the very good points, keep them coming. I'm looking for an idea how to justify Cha to damage stylewise...

A similar bard/rogue feat would be nice too...

 

[Nifft]

By the way, the main reason Nifft and I gave different answers is that we have differing interpretations of what your feat does--note that he points out that the feat is extremely strong if it does what I think it does

Yes, exactly.
So which reading was correct?

-- N

PS: Take a look at Song of the White Raven (from Tome of Battle) for inspiration.

 

[Darklone]

Sigh... looks like I need to get that book after all...

 

[Nifft]

Don't sigh! ToB is the best thing WotC has put out since the Sliced Bread (Su) class feature of the Jedi Sandwich Artisan PrC!

- - -

Anyway, for the record, I agree that increasing the bonus to Inspire Courage is the right thing to do here. I'd allow the feat to switch Int -> Cha, because frankly Int is a stronger ability score if you're not a Paladin, and most Bards are not Paladins. (And I mean "most" literally: there's always that Devoted Performer for the perverse few.)

Cheers, -- N

 

[Darklone]

Devoted Performer.... Everytime I look at that feat, I have these "Praaaaaaise!" sounds in my head.

I'd give them a Frightful Performance special ability. No save for not deaf opponents. And allies.