Daze vs Tasha's Hideous Laughter

[Li Shenron]

I have always thought Daze to be the best cantrips.

What do you think between:

Tasha's Hideous Laughter
2nd Level
effect: target loses 1d3 rounds (and falls prone)

Daze, Extended + Extended
2nd Level (0 + 1 + 1)
effect: target loses 3 rounds

Well, Tasha has +2 on the Will Save DC, and the victim also falls prone, but isn't it much better to double extend Daze instead?
You need Extend Spell (which is anyway my favourite metamagic feat for low levels) but you save a known spell for something else.

 

[Darklone]

That's exactly why they put the 5HD cap into Daze.

I like it, but Tashas rocks too.

 

[Dr_Rictus]

Plus, daze doesn't work on anything but humanoids, while Tasha's merely gives a saving throw bonus to creatures of different types.

 

[Number47]

Sounds like a really great option for a Bard or Sorceror. The slot to know Tasha's would be wasted for them, but Daze is probably the first cantrip they each take. I'll have to recommend it to my Bard player when she gains a couple levels (she's level one now).

 

[candidus_cogitens]

If you ask me, THL is a worthless spell. The main problem is that it doesnt necessarily last more than one round. It's 1d3, not three automatically. So, it might turn out to be no better than daze ... unless it is really important to you to see your victim fall prone and chuckle.

It should be 1d3+1 rounds, at least.

 

[mzsylver]

come on... Tasha's makes them laugh , uncontrollably and HIDEOUSLY, no matter how truncated the 3e title is.

that's GOT to be worth something!

 

[Roland Delacroix]

I have always thought Daze to be the best cantrips.

What do you think between:

Tasha's Hideous Laughter
2nd Level
effect: target loses 1d3 rounds (and falls prone)

Daze, Extended + Extended
2nd Level (0 + 1 + 1)
effect: target loses 3 rounds

Well, Tasha has +2 on the Will Save DC, and the victim also falls prone, but isn't it much better to double extend Daze instead?
You need Extend Spell (which is anyway my favourite metamagic feat for low levels) but you save a known spell for something else.

Hum. Spend a feat to make a Humanoid take a DC (base) 10 save or lose 3 rounds. Or, make any creature take a DC 12 save, and spend the feat on something else. Like Spell Focus, kicking that save up to 14. Since Tashas averages at 2.5 rounds incapacitated and getting up from prone is 1/2 a round, the duration is about the same.

Extend is really best at mid levels for divine buffs that last 1 hour/level. At higher levels it gets decent for 10 min/level spells, but its usually better to just take Persistent Spell.

Both of which don't really matter all that much since at those levels you always open with Haste/Dispel magic anyway. The Spell Focus feat can't be dispelled though. This makes the triple Daze only really good for classes with a limited spell selection.

EDIT: Plus, the coolness of making an enemy rock with uncontrolable laughter can't be beat. If you want Hideous laughter i'd be tempted to research a higher level (3rd?) Tasha's that causes a morale negative to their allies. That would be even cooler.

 

[demon_jr]

in my opinion, i don't really go for spells that have a HD cap, like daze.

at higher levels, there are better spells available that can get the job done. plus, 5 HD creatures at higher levels may not be that much of a challenge.

however, if anyone has any good examples of using daze at higher levels, it would be good to here.

 

[candidus_cogitens]

Re: Re: Daze vs Tasha's Hideous Laughter

Since Tashas averages at 2.5 rounds incapacitated and getting up from prone is 1/2 a round, the duration is about the same.

The average on a d3 is 2. How did you get 2.5?

On another note, I hope you all are aware of the Quiet Contemplation spell in Relics and Rituals. Like Tasha's, it has great amusement potential. Of course, it is a way-overpowered effect for a first-level spell, and would have to be altered if you wanted to bring it into your game ...

 

[Li Shenron]

Spend a feat to make a Humanoid take a DC (base) 10 save or lose 3 rounds. Or, make any creature take a DC 12 save, and spend the feat on something else.

Well, I didn't mean to buy the feat only to extend Daze , but if you are going to choose for a metamagic feat, you are considering how much you're going to use it in several occasions. So IF you take Extend Spell, instead of Tasha you can consider to extend Daze.

The HD cap is the real problem. I was only wondering if for the same level it was better to get a longer duration (3 instead avg2) or Tasha's advantages.

BTW, where does it say that Daze works only on humanoids?