DCC Level 0 Character Funnel is a Bad Concept

[CapnZapp]

Except dwarf, elf and halfling which are automatic. The backgrounds play into it by using player cleverness. If you can come up with a reason why your character has an ability, knowledge, experience or applicable wisdom to a certain situation, the judge has a lot more freedom and liveliness to allow things to happen.

For example...Jacob the armorer has tons of experience working metal and a keen eye for defense, so he has an advantage when looking at a doors hinges, perhaps gaining an advantage on his roll to investigate it...so sees that this door could be removed from the hinges and possibly used as a shield.

It's worth saying there is absolutely no reason to not be generous and say "yes" all the time.

After all they're level 0. No matter how generous you are they can't break the game

 

[overgeeked]

they must have been struck with a moment of megalomania

Any chance you could not randomly make personal attacks against the designers of games you don’t like?

Unfortunately, it's an excluding and expensive gimmick.

Only if you ignore all the free options, like the Purple Sorcerer app and website, all the other dice roller apps and websites that can handle these dice, and all the other ways to simulate these dice on regular dice.

 

[Lanefan]

I’m not carefully avoiding anything. Don’t want risky magic, don’t play DCC.

For me, I want risky magic but nowhere near as risky as DCC as-written makes it.

Two things. One, that’s a built it part of the risk…

And two, you’re dramatically overstating the risk of friendly fire. There are only a few rare edge cases where it might be a problem.

In the 1e-adjacent games I've both DMed and run over the years, in the long run perhaps the biggest threat to the length of your in-character lifespan are the casters you run with.

One fireball cast into a too-small space can ruin a party's entire day.

I don't need the overkill of DCC for that.

 

[Lanefan]

The only way to use basic dice for DCC is to use a bigger die and reroll surplus results:

In order to simulate a d7, you'd roll a d8 and:
1 means 1
2 means 2
3 means 3
...
and so on
7 means 7
8 means you need to roll again

This is a major pain in the butt.

I don't find it so, and I (as player) probably do this to simulate odd-numbered die sizes several times a session. As DM it's even more frequent e.g. there's five characters in the party and I need to know which one the Piercer randomly tries to drop on to, so I'll roll a d6 and if it comes up 6, I'll re-roll.

I get what they're trying to do with DCC and the expanding-die-size mechanic, and I think it's good design. An automated dice roller makes it a non-issue, but the physical dice can be a nuisance.

 

[Lanefan]

Four level-0 characters are often MORE powerful than one level-1 character.

In DCC perhaps.

But in modern D&D, which is where most people cut their teeth on RPGs these days, there's a pretty wide gulf between a commoner and a 1st-level PC. 4e was awful for this, 5e is a bit better but even in 5e there's still room to shoehorn a couple of levels in between commoner and 1st level.

Even in 1e there was room for 0th level between commoner and 1st.

 

[eyeheartawk]

Only if you ignore all the free options, line the Purple Sorcerer app and website, all the other dice roller apps and websites that can handle these dice, and all the other ways to simulate these dice on regular dice.

IIRC there's a table in the book showing you how to simulate the dice with normal polyhedrals.

 

[eyeheartawk]

I have only done funnel to campaign play once. Usually its a one shot (a wonderful one shot at that) or better yet a tournament to see how far you can go before running out of zeroes. Maybe my taste have been forged differently because DCC isnt something I play for any appreciable amount of time. Its one shots or modules that last a few sessions.

I think this is a good point. I'm a strong DCC cheerleader, but yeah, even I don't like it for long campaigns. It really shines in short to medium term play.

 

[CapnZapp]

An automated dice roller makes it a non-issue, but the physical dice can be a nuisance.

If you're playing online or with computer tools at the table.

I would say that if you do have the funny dice, they aren't a nuisance.

It's not having them I was talking about

 

[CapnZapp]

In DCC perhaps.

But in modern D&D, which is where most people cut their teeth on RPGs these days, there's a pretty wide gulf between a commoner and a 1st-level PC. 4e was awful for this, 5e is a bit better but even in 5e there's still room to shoehorn a couple of levels in between commoner and 1st level.

Even in 1e there was room for 0th level between commoner and 1st.

I didn't actually contrast any commoners to level 1 heroes.

I don't know if there are any official level 0 characters in 5th edition, but if they're stronger than Commoners, my rule of thumb probably applies to them as well

 

[CapnZapp]

IIRC there's a table in the book showing you how to simulate the dice with normal polyhedrals.

Absolutely.

And I don't need a chart to simulate a d16 on a d20, or a d5 on a d6.

My point is instead that nit having the exact dice used by a game is a situation most gamers dislike being placed in.

They CAN make it work. It's just a nuisance that can well mean the group chooses another game.