Defeating my powergamer Glave master

[SlyFlourish]

I'm really lucky to have a great group of players that have played weekly for about two years now. We all have a lot of fun and everyone's enjoying the game.

One of them is clearly a powergamer, though. He's playing a human fighter with polearm gambit, power attack, and a whole pile of other feats that give him tons of bonuses when attacking on OAs and tons of ways to put the hurt on guys he's marked. He has a lot of hitpoints and our cleric is very good about keeping him standing up.

I've been playing through Trollhaunt Warrens now and so far I've never really seen a battle that challenged them - mainly because of his uncanny ability to control those he wants to control and do tons of damage (2d4+19 or something) over and over off of his turn because of Polearm Gambit.

What techniques have DMs found for controlling their powergamer fighters? Obviously he puts a lot of time and energy into making his guy an ass kicker so I don't mind that, but I do want to stretch the party and I don't want to do it by just constantly upping the mobs (today, for example, they're fighting a level 15 Beholder Death Tyrant when they just hit level 12).

What suggestions do you have for managing your powergamer?

 

[avin]

Invisible flying gnoll archers with poisonous arrows always works.

 

[Piratecat]

I'd consider sunder every now and again.

 

[CharlesRyan]

I would play directly to his strengths (rather than try to circumvent them). He's clearly happy doing what he's doing, so give him that opportunity every encounter--in fact, try to include a pretty tough adversary that begs for his attention every time.

Then build the rest of the encounter for the rest of the party.

Of course, all of this is easier said than done, and player actions will cause any given encounter to unfold in unforeseen ways. . . .

 

[Dausuul]

I'm really lucky to have a great group of players that have played weekly for about two years now. We all have a lot of fun and everyone's enjoying the game.

One of them is clearly a powergamer, though. He's playing a human fighter with polearm gambit, power attack, and a whole pile of other feats that give him tons of bonuses when attacking on OAs and tons of ways to put the hurt on guys he's marked. He has a lot of hitpoints and our cleric is very good about keeping him standing up.

I've been playing through Trollhaunt Warrens now and so far I've never really seen a battle that challenged them - mainly because of his uncanny ability to control those he wants to control and do tons of damage (2d4+19 or something) over and over off of his turn because of Polearm Gambit.

What techniques have DMs found for controlling their powergamer fighters? Obviously he puts a lot of time and energy into making his guy an ass kicker so I don't mind that, but I do want to stretch the party and I don't want to do it by just constantly upping the mobs (today, for example, they're fighting a level 15 Beholder Death Tyrant when they just hit level 12).

What suggestions do you have for managing your powergamer?

Target him with extra-tough monsters and the rest of the party with not-as-tough monsters. Conveniently, he's playing the defender, which means you have a lot of options for this. For instance, you could throw a couple of big brutes or soldiers at the party, which your uber-glaive-wielder will lock down and slug it out with; meanwhile, back up the brutes and soldiers with artillery that can shoot at the other PCs. Make the brutes/soldiers level+3, or even level+4 if you think he can take it, while the artillery is level+1 or level+2.

 

[green slime]

I've run into a similar situation; one of my players enjoys dominating the battlefield, with a spiked chain, trip, etc.

There are lots of ways to continue to challenge the party, even with such a dominant fighter on the battlefield. Mind you, they should be used sparingly.

1. Swamp the party with lots of combatants. I mean lots. So that the fighter has his hands completely full. They don't have to be very tough. But lots. Run best in an outside setting. Include archers. Advantage here is also that it is relatively easy to split the party up: Say the battle is taking place on a farm: you have multiple buildings, multiple threats from various angles, and with squads of enemies darting around; chasing one group will lead into an ambush (with readied actions), and the diverse angles prevent PC's from nuking a majority. Add in a concerned farmer to prevent WMD. Swamp the fighter, and concentrate fire on the fighter. When the fighter is swamped, it is difficult for the cleric to actually get to the fighter to heal him. Especially useful if the fighter is a bit gungho, and charges ahead of everyone (chasing some fleeing opponents). Aide Another in grapples.

2. Large creatures and reach weapons.

But I prefer lots. Lots and lots and lots of opponents. So even if the Party is superior, they don't feel like they are in control. In a battle against a single powerful foe, it is easy for the party to dictate the pace and flow of the battle. Not so against a horde of invading orc/goblin barbarians or the like. More keep appearing.

 

[Nymrohd]

Maybe also include a lurker that profits from the combat advantage he seems to so freely grant with Polearm Gambit. Remind him that that feat provides a trade. And in general if you want to frustrate a fighter you want artillery with good range or teleporting skirmishers.

 

[amysrevenge]

In general:

1) You can't make OAs if you're dazed
2) You can't make OAs at hidden foes

A couple of screw-job ways to deal with it I suppose.

This might help a tiny bit, at least with teleporting foes (who shouldn't trigger Polearm Gambit anymore I think).

Q: Where is the target of your attack when you make an opportunity attack with the Polearm Gamble feat?

A: An opportunity attack interrupts the action that triggers it; so when you make the opportunity attack, the target is in the square it's leaving, assuming that square is within your melee reach.

 

[Fanaelialae]

A fighter with +19 damage at level 12? I know you said "or something," but if that is the case it seems a bit high (though I haven't had any defenders yet who went hardcore offense, so I could be mistaken).

Are you certain he's calculating his damage correctly? One common mistake players make is multiplying their Str x 1.5 for two handers. Two handers use Str x 1 just like all other weapons (not counting the versatile bonus where applicable).

It might also make sense if he's adding conditional damage modifiers, but those are conditional, so his base damage bonus ought to be a little lower.

 

[Nymrohd]

I can see how it works. We are talking opportunity attacks here right? He gets:
+5 Strength bonus
+3 Enhancement bonus from weapon
Power Attack (+4 at Paragon)
+3 Marked Scourge (+Wis on marked which is high on a polearm master)
Bracers of Mighty Striking (+4 to basic attacks)
All this gives +19 and still no weapon focus for another +2.