Diagonal Movement - Better or Worse?

[Regicide]

We use 1:1 and every so often get a laugh over how silly it is, but whatever. "The monster form a circle around you and the largest of them steps out and challenges you" "that looks like a square" "yes, yes it does, you're in a squared circle!"

I can't believe people find it faster though. I mean... really?

 

[Asmor]

Grids to me say "You are not trusted to measure honestly and or accurately."

Grids to me say, "Here's everything you need to know; no guesswork required."

I can't stand ambiguity in games... (in Mage Knight tournaments, the only free-form movement game I've ever played, you were allowed to specifically say something like "It's my intention that this dude is just outside the range of that dude" so that ambiguities could be avoided, and assuming what you were saying was geometrically possible).

On the other hand, if I were looking for a more simulationist experience, I'd definitely prefer free-form.

I can't believe people find it faster though. I mean... really?

Yes, really. If you can make a complicated movement involving alternately taking orthogonal and diagonal steps, with some difficult terrain thrown in, without asking, "wait, is this an even or an odd move," then you're a better man than I (or anyone I've ever played with).

 

[Regicide]

Yes, really. If you can make a complicated movement involving alternately taking orthogonal and diagonal steps, with some difficult terrain thrown in, without asking, "wait, is this an even or an odd move," then you're a better man than I (or anyone I've ever played with).

I'd point fingers and laugh, but I'm sure you're simply making a straw man to defend the new system. Adding 1.5 on diagonals then rounding down is grade 1 math, and I doubt you're playing with people who are under 5 years old.

 

[ExploderWizard]

It screwed with my head too when I first heard about it. After a couple sessions we haven't noticed anything earth shattering about the rule. There is the occasional "bargain" move to be had from time to time but both sides have this advantange.

 

[ExploderWizard]

In all honesty, I can't fathom why anyone favors hexes for anything.

They work rather well for games that take facing into account.

 

[James McMurray]

Hexes to me feel more organic than square grids, though by the time the group can handle hex based movement, they generaly are ready to get rid of the grid and measure.

Ewww! No thanks! We measured for a tiny fraction of one campaign and that was enough for me. I don't mind it when I'm playing a tactical combat game like Battletech or Warhammer, but when I'm RPing the slow down is way too much.

I can't believe people find it faster though. I mean... really?

It's fractionally faster when you're just walking across the board. It's incredibly faster when you're going to move, think about attacking, look up a rule, decide not to attack that target, attack a different target, answer the door because the pizza's here and you're buying, then try to remember how far you've moved so you can move again. The increase in speed approaches infinity if that rule lookup turns into a rules debate and by the time you're done two different people remember you starting in two different squares.

It's never gotten quite that bad for us, but close. We did it for years in previous editions, and we'll do it again when another game calls for it. But there's no way I'd house rule going back to it in 4e. It's too fun and there's too much stuff tied to it that would have to be ignored or changed.

 

[frankthedm]

I'd point fingers and laugh, but I'm sure you're simply making a straw man to defend the new system. Adding 1.5 on diagonals then rounding down is grade 1 math, and I doubt you're playing with people who are under 5 years old.

While the math is not be that hard, don't you think taking jabs like that one is just a wee bit over the line for enworld?

 

[Stogoe]

It's fractionally faster when you're just walking across the board. It's incredibly faster when you're going to move, think about attacking, look up a rule, decide not to attack that target, attack a different target, answer the door because the pizza's here and you're buying, then try to remember how far you've moved so you can move again. The increase in speed approaches infinity if that rule lookup turns into a rules debate and by the time you're done two different people remember you starting in two different squares.

It's never gotten quite that bad for us, but close. We did it for years in previous editions, and we'll do it again when another game calls for it. But there's no way I'd house rule going back to it in 4e. It's too fun and there's too much stuff tied to it that would have to be ignored or changed.

This deserves to be read and re-read and re-re-read by people still unconvinced that 1:1 speeds up the game immensely.

 

[DracoSuave]

I would -hate- to be on a 1.5 diagonal table when I had to adjudicate a push power or pull power....

....good thing that rarely happens in D&D4 eh?

 

[Kitirat]

While the math is not be that hard, don't you think taking jabs like that one is just a wee bit over the line for enworld?

"I'd point fingers and laugh, but I'm sure you're simply making a straw man to defend the new system. Adding 1.5 on diagonals then rounding down is grade 1 math, and I doubt you're playing with people who are under 5 years old."


I have a 5 year old boy who is extremely advanced in math, 1st in his class. adding 1.5 on diagonals and rounding down is not grade 1, it is grade 3. They are still in add and subtract at 5 years old. Stop belittling little ones.

I did not like the rule at ALL, then played 4th and found it was really that much faster and far more importantly greatly reduces the time it takes to determine the "most advantagous" path to places. It is not the counting, it is possibility of alternate paths giving vastly different results and the iterative process of a player (or most commonly group of players since terrain effects most everyone but bow rangers in the back) going through each interation to determine what gives him the best result. Because every step is "1" it GREATLY reduces the total iterative time per person for movement as terrain effects, not when to shift is the only factor outside of mob placement. It is for this reason we found the 1:1 rule works best for game play.

I find humor as a Master level Engineer whom uses math heavily each day how much people will "Self indulge" the stroking of their intellect and not try something new due to their pre-bias. If scientists on the leading edge of technology only did what models could predict, we'd have very little progress. A true sign of intellect is the capacity to look beyond logic and bias and explore new possibilities and determine if they have advantage unforeseen prior to experimentation.

I'd suggest you try it out Regicide before calling "strawman on others."

See ya,
Kitirat