Diplomacy skill and adventure design.

[Shallown]

Originally Posted by Shallown
It's not a matter, in my mind, of randomizing the event or element as much as providing an alternate frame work around an encounter that uses the diplomacy skill.


Gizmo33
I don't know what you mean here. From what I can tell from your examples, there were two problems with diplomacy: 1. it diminished the significance of players RPing their characters 2. the dice roll could lead to unanticipated consequences. Those were the two points I had in mind in my previous post.


My examples where to illustrate possible problems with using the Diplomacy skill. I may have missunderstood the point you were making I am a bit thick headed



A failed Diplomacy check wouldn't ruin the game or anything I guess what I am trying to figure out is would putting the modifiers and other information in be worthwhile. Is laying out the encounter as both a skill roll and a straight roleplaying event (or a mix) worth the time or would it make the encounter more difficult to run or influence the GM into subsitituting skills for role playing.



Gizmo33
I know you're probably working on stuff that's proprietary, but I suspect I could understand the situation better with some specific examples.

No nothing at all proprietary on my end I stole all of it from the SRD and old gamma World stuff. I was just making it for my own use but to actually write it I try to write it at a professional level as practice. I might someday write adventures for the public domain after I hit the lottery

So the specific encounter that sprang to mind while I was writing was the Encounter with the Lil Prince who needs the characters aid to free his father, the King. The king has information the PC's could use but is not neccessary to the point of the adventure.

As I have it written it is pretty much a straight forward roleplaying encounter unless the PC's for some reason out right attack the Lil. I was wondering while I was working on setting out some knowldege DC's on Lil for the PC's to attempt why I didn't Also have Diplomacy Dc's.

I hadn't really thought or setting the encounter up that way. My Intent on writing the Encounter was to show not everything is out to kill you in Gamma world but You can make allies and friends. Now if it didn't work out that way it really wouldn'y affect the actual goal of the PC's

 

[Shallown]

Thanks Silverbane.

What you said was sort of what I was looking for. I am on the fence as to how to write it up and to what extent. You have some good points to consider and what you wrote lends closest to my style as a writer.

Later

 

[Michael Silverbane]

Glad I could help.

Later
silver

 

[Dykstrav]

Just on the discussion of Diplomacy as a skill...

I've always kind of felt like Diplomacy checks can sometimes earn you an XP award. The rogue finds a trap and disarms in in the dungeon, he gets XP. Why not for the rogue who uses Gather Information to find a contact and then follows with Diplomacy to get what he wants? Or for that matter, a paladin or cleric who convinces a hostile tribe of orcs to stop attacking caravans and the like?

But I do feel that the Diplomacy skill is a bit vague. I'd like to see more specific results for what you're trying to do beyond changing someone's attitude.

 

[airwalkrr]

Note my sig.

 

[Evilhalfling]

Im using an adventure design recommended on the WotC site.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ab/20060824a

I first look at what the diplomacy skills of the party are,
setting DCs to match the skill levels, 5-18 above skill (with minimums to punish no diplomacy parties)

then I ask them to role play out the encounter, in either 1st or 3rd person
add a +/- 5 for tactics, then hae them role, with both sucess and fail options possible.

 

[DonTadow]

For me, the role-playing that takes place around the table is the game. Moving minis around and rolling dice is just a game within the game. It's good old fun. However, there is a reward in role-playing around an obstacle that just isn't awarded by rolling dice. There is no denying that.

I agree with you here. This is a role playing game. Now, if we were playing a rockclimbing game, I'd want them to climb rocks regardless. If we were playing a sword fighting game, Id want them to start sword fighting. Since its a role playing game, players should role play, else break out decent or D and D: the board game.

That said, I don't think the roleplaying should negate the importance of the dice. After all game does follow the roleplaying . I use diplomacy to determine if the roleplaying was successful or not with the roleplaying being a subjective bonus on my part. Neither the dice or roleplaying is an option.

 

[Dave Turner]

Note my sig.

Airwalkrr,

The post you reference in your .sig essentially boils down to DM fiat which, while a legitimate approach, does little to defend the broken and useless nature of the Diplomacy skill in the RAW.

 

[DonTadow]

If you aren't going to make players actually climb walls, hide in shadows, or swing their greatswords, then it's fine to make them roll for social interaction as well. I

If I"m rock climbing I should be espected to climb rocks right? Well if you're role playing shouldn't you do some role playing?

 

[Cosmic.Justice]

The only bonus to roleplaying should be a furthering of the story, increased experience, or opportunities for character advancement in a personal sense. Adding bonuses or negatives to a Diplomacy roll through that method is penalizing or rewarding players based on their own social skills, not their characters.

It is precisely the same as giving bonuses to a player who can pull out a Kendo blade and demonstrate the exact manuevers his Iaijutsu Master is using to decapitate the feared Ogre Lord.

The question I have is, would you reward more the charismatic, personable player who gave a brilliant, well thought out and insightful diplomatic introduction the king, with his Charisma 11, Diplomacy +4 character, or the same player who took a more reserved, basic tact that better represents his characters actual skills?