Discussion - General Discussion Thread '08

[Trouvere]

The wiki page for Orussus here says 20,000 gp.

I wonder, though, whether there aren't also implicit limits to item purchases because of the generally observed decision to avoid high level NPCs. Our local NPC wizard, Rilithorne, is about 9th level; Rayne Liore, however, is at least 13th. Are cheap staffs rods and rings available in Orussus? If so, who makes them, since there are no 12th level casters? Are they turned up in sufficient numbers to satisfy demand when NPC farmers plough their fields? Are there offstage NPC adventurers with extraordinary luck but a singular lack of ambition?

 

[Knight Otu]

Tenebrynn at least has both the feat and the spell required. Ashnar only has the feat, and I think Iggy has neither.

There actually was a discussion about the topic of magic items and high-level NPCs needed for them. I also once posted a proposal, but it didn't exactly go anywhere. Too much listwork for little benefit. As such, items that technically shouldn't be available still are.

 

[Robichaud]

Gets funnier when you consider that with some other crafting feats, e.g. Craft Magic Arms and Armor, it's very easy for even a modestly leveled crafter to stack properties on an item until it's far in excess of the GP limit. Pricing system's quirky like that.

The biggest problems in fixing it are rings and scrolls - rings because there's rather a lot of affordable ones low-level adventurers could reasonably use, scrolls because they're a way to access potentially very high-level magic on the cheap, and consumable to boot, making a "passed on throughout the ages" explanation less likely.

At least staffs aren't that much of a problem - they're not as popular anyway, and as far as I know there's only one standard staff costing 20,000 or less.

 

[Trouvere]

Indeed - I meant to type 'rods' and corrected in my posting above.

That proposal seemed quite sensible to me. A pity it was shot down, imo. Compared to some of the things we deal with in this game, checking in the SRD that an item desired from an anonymous NPC costs less than x gp and doesn't require a spell or feat unavailable to a 9th level character doesn't seem particularly onerous.

The trouble is, we would probably need to make exceptions for useful cheap rings. And then we're back to a case by case approval basis, and it all spirals out of control.

Oh well.

 

[Knight Otu]

Well, it wasn't exactly vetoed (I only withdrew it), but it received 11 posts in about that many months, so...

 

[Dire Tadpole]

Blindborn Template

The blindborn template removes many of the penalties for being blind.

According to the SRD these penalties include:

-A -2 penalty to Armor Class
-Loses Dexterity bonus to AC (if any)
-moves at half speed
-takes a -4 penalty on Search checks
-takes a -4 penalty on most Strength- and Dexterity-based skill checks.
-All checks and activities that rely on vision (such as reading and Spot checks) automatically fail.
-All opponents are considered to have total concealment (50% miss chance) to the blinded character.

Of these penalties, which do the blindborn template overcome?

 

[Halford]

Frankly there a great many items which strain credulity when one considers who would be necessary to create them. Lets take the most glaring example, Universal Solvent, price 50gp, CL 20th! We are supposed to believe that there is a 20th level Wizard who spends a day to make a 50gp item? Really?

Pearls of Power are another one that I believe Wizards fluffed badly, especially since their near direct counterparts the Cognizance Crystals have a far more sensible caster level requirement which essentially requires the caster to be high enough level to cast the spell.

I would suggest changeing both of these items requirements up - or in the case of Universal Solvent at least allowing a caveat that a large batch of 20 uses can be made in a day.

 

[covaithe]

As I understand it, the CL listed with magic items is not a prereq to be able to make them, it's just the number to roll against for things like SR and dispel magic and such.

 

[Knight Otu]

-All checks and activities that rely on vision (such as reading and Spot checks) automatically fail.
-All opponents are considered to have total concealment (50% miss chance) to the blinded character.

Let me get check on that, but I'm pretty sure those two at least should apply.

As I understand it, the CL listed with magic items is not a prereq to be able to make them, it's just the number to roll against for things like SR and dispel magic and such.

That's generally correct (weapon and armor enhancement bonuses, and ioun stones are definite exceptions that come to mind). Universal solvent itself can only be created from 11th level onwards, though, due to disintegrate as a prerequisite. Pearls of Power only require the creator to be able to cast spells of the intended level, so it ought to be possible to get up to 4th level pearls of power either way.

 

[Knight Otu]

I think these are all wondrous items that have prerequisites that would prevent them from being bought. Most of them are too pricey to be bought in Orussus anyway, but I've marked those that could be bought with an exclamation mark or two. The weapons and armors are in the thread linked above (with one error; the sword of planes shouldn't be on the list, since plane shift is 5th level for clerics).

[sblock]Apparatus of the Crab (animate objects)
Bowl of Commanding Water Elementals (summon monster VI, VII)
!Bracelet of Friends (refuge)
Bracers of Armor +5 and higher (2*bonus caster level)
Barzier of Commanding Fire Elementals (summon monster VI, VII)
!Candle of Invocation (gate)
Censer of Controlling Air Elementals (summon monster VI, IX)
Chaos Diamond (cloak of chaos, word of chaos)
Cloak of Etherealness (Ethereal Jaunt)
Efreeti Bottle (summon monster VII)
Eyes of Petrification (flesh to stone)
!Figurines of Wondrous Power, all (animate objects, others)
!Golem Manuals, all (several different)
Helm of Brilliance (prismatic spray)
Horn of Blasting, Greater (greater shout)
Horn of Valhalla (summon monster VI)
Instant Fortress (mage's magnificent mansion)
Ioun Stones, all (caster level 12+)
Iron Bands of Binding (grasping hand)
Iron Flask (trap the soul)
Manuals of Bodily Health, Gainful Exercise, and Quickness in Action (wish/miracle)
Mask of the Skull (animate objects, finger of death)
Mattock of the Titans (move earth)
Maul of the Titans (clenched fist)
Mirror of Life Trapping (imprisonment)
Mirror of Mental Prowess (gate, legend lore)
Mirror of Opposition (clone)
Orb of Storms (control weather, storm of vengeance)
Pearl of Power lvl 5+ (spell slots)
!Periapt of Wound Closure (heal)
!Phylactery of Undead Turning (level)
Ring Gates (gate)
Robe of the Archmagi (antimagic field)
Rope of Entanglement (animate objects)
!Scarab, Golembane (caster level)
!Shrouds of Disintegration (disintegrate)
Stone of Controlling Earth Elementals (summon monster VI, VII)
!Stone Horse, all (flesh to stone, animate objects)
!Stone Salve (flesh to stone)
Prayer Beads of Summons and Wind Walking (gate/wind walk)
Tomes of Clear Thought, Leadership and Influence, and Understanding (wish/miracle)
!!Universal Solvent (disintegrate)
Well of Many Worlds (gate)[/sblock]

Golembane scarabs are an interesting case regarding the listed caster level not being a prerequisite.