DM Familiair vs. Campaign Suite vs. others...

This would sound crazy, but has anyone here actually bought a laptop specifically for use in gaming? Cause after reading all these reviews it sounds tempting to me.

I need to take a cold shower so my credit card doesn't melt from compulsive shopping.
 

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Thanks for all the helpful replies, for me personally I need a good organizational tool that allows support of custom material. Mostly organizational needs. The other thing I really need is something that allows quick preperation of an encounter, creature, or NPC. I don't use a machine at the table right now so in game support is not that necessary.

To Azure Trance:
Yeah I am considering buying a second or third generation laptop just for the gaming table. If I can find one reasonably on one of the auction sites, or even a refurb, I will.

Thanks all
Thullgrim
 

thullgrim said:
Thanks for all the helpful replies, for me personally I need a good organizational tool that allows support of custom material. Mostly organizational needs. The other thing I really need is something that allows quick preperation of an encounter, creature, or NPC. I don't use a machine at the table right now so in game support is not that necessary.

To Azure Trance:
Yeah I am considering buying a second or third generation laptop just for the gaming table. If I can find one reasonably on one of the auction sites, or even a refurb, I will.

Thanks all
Thullgrim

What you describe is exactly what we've designed Campaign Suite to do. Instant characters, class/race/feat editors, dungeon generation, encounter tables, weather, map storage, expansions based on d20 products, etc.
 

thullgrim said:
To Azure Trance:
Yeah I am considering buying a second or third generation laptop just for the gaming table. If I can find one reasonably on one of the auction sites, or even a refurb, I will.

Thullgrim

For curiousitys sake I was browsing on the net for older models. I mean, minimum 100-200MHZ range, and it looks like their still in the few hundred area. That, I thought, was good. It's so dated you can pretty much only use it for that and word processing. I tried looking for something that was decent, like 400MHZ or so but that's a really popular price range to sell at as well :/

Of course I looked at what a good one would cost me; bah, I might as well be made out of money once it gets into the 4 digit range.

But I found out, spend a teensy bit more (relatively speaking) and for another hundred (or two) you could get something really nice, like a DeskNote (2.4GHZ, 128RAM, 14" screen, 4 USB 2.0 ports, 10GB HD - $600). Hell, you could play CivIII on it while riding the train to work. Not that I would; but just knowing that I could.

Anyway, I suck at this whole staying out of debt thing. The credit card gods own my soul.
 

I recently got my hands on an old IBM Thinkpad with a 233MHz chip, and I'm setting it up to use at the gaming table. I'm installing all the various tools on it (or at least demo versions, so I can get a feel for what they do).

I guess it really comes down to which one suits your style of gaming, and is easy for you to understand. I've tried each tool a few months back, but I need to review them all again to see if there are any changes that will influence my final decision. I know what I didn't like about them the last time I tried them (please note these are just IMHO)

RPM: too complex and not intuitive. I never could get far enough before becoming frustrated to find out what it's real power is. I know, if I RTFM I could probably get a lot further.

PCGen: too slow, sometimes not intuitive. but does have a lot to it for character creation. But that's all it does.

E-Tools: too underpowered (but generally very intuitive!)

DMF: would be nice if it did more. The tree thingy doesn't do it for me as an information repository, but the combat matrix is nice.

DMG: haven't tried it yet.

CS: What little I've used out of CS I like. Seems intuitive, I'll probably need to purchase the full version in order to find out whether I really like it or not as an in-game tool. I wish they'd just do a full use time limit demo rather than limited use.
 

I'm using DM Genie for one simple reason: it comes with a set of excellent tutorials that cover every aspect of the program. After an hour or so with the tutorials I felt like a DM Genie power-user while DM's Familiar and RolePlayingMaster are still somewhat mysterious to me.

I think DMG is actually the most feature-packed of the bunch, although RPM comes pretty close (and is also the only one that I know of with a battle map). I also like the DMG interface the best because it fits the most information onto a single screen.
 

DM Genie gets my vote....

I have tried RPM, DM Familiar and DM Genie.

These programs are all primarily DM assistants. While they do have features for game preperation and for individual players, I think they are best suited to being used at the game table by a DM. None have character creation that is as feature packed as, for example, PCGEN, but they really shine when it comes to managing a game session and speeding up play. I use them to conduct combat and manage adventures, still letting the players make their own die rolls, but running everything else through the computer.

RPM is feature-packed, but I find it a bit unwieldy. If I needed or wanted the mapping functions, this one probably would have been my choice, since that feature is pretty cool. However, we use a megamat at the table so I am not concerned with having a combat map display on my computer. This one is worth a look, however, if you are looking for something that includes a ton of stuff (and the kitchen sink).

DM Familiar is very slick and easy to use. Of the three, this is the most approachable and offered the shortest learning curve. It's combat functions and NPC creation are pretty well done. However, it's relative ease-of-use is indicative of its comparitive simplicity. There is a lot of combat stuff that it doesn't track. I do like the interface on this, which simply lets you open whatever windows you want, size them as you want, and place them where you want. It's flexible and intuitive.

DM Genie is the one I've tried most recently, and I am REALLY impressed. It includes a ton of features. The combat functions are really well done. You can track all sorts of effects (whether they be from magic spells or the result of actions), and DM Genie does all the math to determine effective attack bonuses and AC. It's nice to not have to worry about all of the modifiers that are in play, and you can focus on giving your players some exciting combat with clever and ruthless NPC's/Monsters ;) I love the way you can combine effects with spells. When a character casts a spell, a window will pop-up asking you which character gets the effect of the spell; the program will then track and changes to stats, AC, AR, etc.

The interface for DM Genie does a good job of giving you the maxium amount of information in a single screen. There are also a lot of ancillary windows you can open, for things like tracking time and weather. The adventure reference uses a threaded hypertext inteface that contains a lot of features. For example, I am running my players through the SUnless Citadel module. I scanned in the maps from the module, imported them into DM Genie, and then set up hot spots for each encounter location. As they move through the Citadel, all I have to do is click on hot spots to reveal information on combat encounters, treasure, etc. You can automatically start combat and give selected characters treasure and equipment on the fly. How cool is that?

Of course, I also tend to be sold on a program when you make a feature suggestion in the morning and it has been implemented with a new version that night ;)

Anyway, all 3 of these tools are really solid. Each of the authors is very active in supporting their tools. You really can't go wrong with any of them, and it comes down to a matter of preferences and the features you want/need. I think that of the three RPM is probably the most robust in terms of character creation, DM Familiar is the easiest to use and easiest to set-up, and DM Genie offers the best balance of features and "coolness". DM Genie is pretty new, and already feature-packed, so it's pretty exciting to think about what's down the road. I will be registering the program today.

One caveat ... while the complexity of these programs does vary, each requires an investment of time to get over the learning curve and determine which one is right for your needs. Don't expect them to be like playing NWN ... they are dealing with a very complex system while still retaining complete flexibility for the DM (And all the while adhering to OGC standards), so you may find yourself doing a bit of head-scratching at first but the results will be worth it.
 

Azure Trance said:


Anyway, I suck at this whole staying out of debt thing. The credit card gods own my soul.

A few tips. They seem to be have great resistances to slashing and bludgoning weapons. And piercing weapons are almost out of the question. But they seem to be related to trolls in that fire and acid work very well. Plus, there's the cool bubble effect that fire has on the girggling bodies. ;)

Just kill them, take the XP, and get on with your declining debt life.

And now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

And I suck at spelling.

And I use the word "and" far too much.
 

Design issues and on-going work

smc said:
RPM is feature-packed, but I find it a bit unwieldy. If I needed or wanted the mapping functions, this one probably would have been my choice, since that feature is pretty cool. However, we use a megamat at the table so I am not concerned with having a combat map display on my computer. This one is worth a look, however, if you are looking for something that includes a ton of stuff (and the kitchen sink).
[/B]

Thanks for that smc. I'll explain some things about the current state of RPM, and the approach to in-game issues:

RPM has only just being released as a full version, with character and adventure building capabilities quite complete. An enormous amount of effort has gone into the underlying RPG engine, to pave the way for the "ultimate" utility.
As I mentioned in my release, the focus is now is largely to improve the interface to make it smoother. This is comparatively simple, compared to the underlying engine, and input from people such as yourself is very welcome.

I think that on close examination, you'll find that RPM has an unparalled capability for in-game power, presented in a completely open and extendable fashion. The goal is an RPG engine capability similar to NeverWinterNights, and is recognizable as something like PCGen with increased in-game options.

To explain some of the key design decisions:
You won't see things like "Barbarian Rage" or points for "Power Attack" and "Expertise" hard-coded onto the screen. Whilst not too bad in the core system, in the openly expandable system, you can't afford screen space for things that may not apply.

For this reason RPM builds up "Options" for anything you have that needs them, into a single, simple list. These are built up from openly configurable and extendable stuff. For example, RPM program contains no special core code for any class or feats, yet is capable of handling monk class, or clerical domains - by user configuration.

As an example (using code I'm tidying up right now), consider a multi-classed Monk afflicted with Lycanthropy which has feats Rapid Shot, Expertise and Power Attack and Alertness.
The options are automatically built up for simple choices of your "Flurry of Blows", whether or not Monk BAB is used, whether to accept the penalty for the Rapid Shot, and Power attack and Expertise points, as well as whether you're in Lycanthropic form.
These simple choices can be altered at any time, resulting in instant recalcultion of the stats.
Whilst the complexities of combat are quite recognizable, what RPM will do in this case for something as simple as a skill like Listen is quite enlightening, as follows:
- The standard wisdom ability adjustment is there, taking into account any magic, equipment, or conditions.
- The standard listen ranks you've taken are, of course, there.
- An extra 4 ranks will be there, because you added the Lycanthrope (Werebear, whatever) template.
- An extra 2 ranks are in there marked as being for Alertness.
- In addition another 4 ranks will be added in, if you're currently in lycanthropic form. An easy detail to miss.

As is standard for RPM skill checks, all typical DCs for the Listen skill are instantly available from a dropdown ("people talking", "quite slow pace" etc), along with standard modifiers for the skill (distance, listen through a dorr, a stone wall etc).

The point is that, as a DM in particular, you cannot afford to notice a lot of fine (but important) detail when managing a whole bunch of creatures that can easily be individually as complex as a PC in 3rd edition.

I believe that the core design is crucial, especially if you want extensions beyond the simple core.
I believe that RPM has the right design. In particular, its open-ness and power makes it easily extendable without introducing violations of Wizard's licenses.
I'm also confident that even minor tweaks of the user interface will make it more friendly, and that the process will continue from there.

I'll also explain why I use location markers on the map for jumping to location descriptions, instead of entire surface blocks:
Basically I use the mouse for many other things on the map, such as dragging around creature markers, and clicking to create new creatures on a particular spot. Even if you use a table mat, dragging creatures around is very useful for setting up initial creature locations during game preparation.
It may not actually be obvious that you can drag and drop from a list of locations you've created onto the map. You can drag from the creature list onto the map as well. I get e-mails from people who've used RPM for a long time, saying they're still discovering new things in RPM. The trick is to polish that user interface so that all the hidden capabilities are more obvious :rolleyes:

Regards,
 
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Azure Trance said:
This would sound crazy, but has anyone here actually bought a laptop specifically for use in gaming? Cause after reading all these reviews it sounds tempting to me.

I need to take a cold shower so my credit card doesn't melt from compulsive shopping.

Sort of. Our laptop is really only used for surfing right now, but since we're playtesting RPM tomorrow, if we like it, the laptop will essentially become a tabletop RP machine.
 

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