I am a new DM and (maybe foolishly) allowed the Exalted Deeds book in the campaign. I am now dealing with a beguiler with Vow of Peace and Nymph's Kiss. Essentially all creatures have to roll a DC 19 will save anytime they are within 20 feet of this char. I don't want to completely throw out his character and would really like to see how he plays at higher levels, but I am concerned that no real combat will happen unless I put the party up against only constructs. Does anyone have some ideas as to how to "defeat" or work around this complication. This is a low level campaign with leveling occurring every week or two to start with. I want the characters to get up to level 5-7 in the next couple of months or so. Everyone is level 2 right now.
DM Help with Exalted Deeds
- Thread starter cowboyct
- Start date
You can sick Incarnates on them. This is from the Magic of Incarnum which is a book of characters that can make their own sets of interchangeable buffs that resemble items called soulmelds. One soulmeld at level 2 called the Enigma helm can give immunity to the calm emotions effect. The evil type sort of specialize in dealing melee damage and with their incarnate weapon can still be very effective melee characters at low levels without much gold investment.
Neither defeat or any variations of "defeat" is an option. As a DM, your job is to provide your players a good gaming experience.
That said, if you really want to be a wee mean about it... I can think of a few tricks to throw your beguiler off from his metaphorical horse
I have quite the experience in payback, actually. (Hey, nobody said I'm a perfect DM either, did they?) Using immune creatures isn't subtle enough, not to mention a very unfair move; taking away his trump card would make your beguiler's player feel useless. What follows are a few less evil, shady moves to achieve what you need.
1. solution: Make the Vow of Peace impractical in at least several situations! Since the aura affects all creatures, not just enemies, have the party group up with NPCs who are penalized by it via the plot, such as Barbarians, Bards or Dread Witches(Add extra extra hostile creatures or design sieges/ambushes so to stay at the appropriate CR). That will encourage him to think about using it at least.
2.: Curses, the taint of evil, afflictions, dismemberment... In short, permanent stat penalties. They won't make him unable to spam his aura, but they are enough to balance him until higher levels when the team's healer can patch him up.
3.: If I were you, I'd make use of irony. You said the beguiler has the Nymph's Kiss feat(I hope you are aware it doesn't give bonus to the DC of the Vow of Peace, just Charisma checks and saves; you phrased it as such, thus I felt I should point it out, just in case). Did he describe with whom he is/was in a close relationship with? It's not an actual requirement, but the Nymph's Kiss feat mentions the bonus comes from a maintained intimate affair with a fey. Why he has the benefits then? Because they never broke up, and the girl was waiting for the poor guy all this time of course! So throw his ex at him, hilarity ensues! It won't even be hard; they'll be justified to meet just about anywhere in the wilderness, depending on her race, and some circumstances can easily force them to group up. If he plays his cards smart, maybe they'll get together again; if he doesn't, sucks for him. And there you have a perfectly understandable plot twist to hide your revenge behind.
I'd come up with a less malicious significant other for him than a bitchy nymph or a clichic driad if he doesn't prefer those either, though. Female satyr are nice and shy in stark contrast with the males, for instance. A shy fey is still a fey, so you'd have to come up with a good excuse as to why is she even more withdrawn than average, unless you'd roleplay out a lot of unmentionables. They have... quite the drive.
4.: Grab your copy of Cityscape and paradigm shift your adventure into roleplay galore for a while! He will still make use of his aura(such as calming down rioters or panicked crowds), but no combat feat breaks a campaign low on combat.
That said, if you really want to be a wee mean about it... I can think of a few tricks to throw your beguiler off from his metaphorical horse
I have quite the experience in payback, actually. (Hey, nobody said I'm a perfect DM either, did they?) Using immune creatures isn't subtle enough, not to mention a very unfair move; taking away his trump card would make your beguiler's player feel useless. What follows are a few less evil, shady moves to achieve what you need.1. solution: Make the Vow of Peace impractical in at least several situations! Since the aura affects all creatures, not just enemies, have the party group up with NPCs who are penalized by it via the plot, such as Barbarians, Bards or Dread Witches(Add extra extra hostile creatures or design sieges/ambushes so to stay at the appropriate CR). That will encourage him to think about using it at least.
2.: Curses, the taint of evil, afflictions, dismemberment... In short, permanent stat penalties. They won't make him unable to spam his aura, but they are enough to balance him until higher levels when the team's healer can patch him up.
3.: If I were you, I'd make use of irony. You said the beguiler has the Nymph's Kiss feat(I hope you are aware it doesn't give bonus to the DC of the Vow of Peace, just Charisma checks and saves; you phrased it as such, thus I felt I should point it out, just in case). Did he describe with whom he is/was in a close relationship with? It's not an actual requirement, but the Nymph's Kiss feat mentions the bonus comes from a maintained intimate affair with a fey. Why he has the benefits then? Because they never broke up, and the girl was waiting for the poor guy all this time of course! So throw his ex at him, hilarity ensues! It won't even be hard; they'll be justified to meet just about anywhere in the wilderness, depending on her race, and some circumstances can easily force them to group up. If he plays his cards smart, maybe they'll get together again; if he doesn't, sucks for him. And there you have a perfectly understandable plot twist to hide your revenge behind.
I'd come up with a less malicious significant other for him than a bitchy nymph or a clichic driad if he doesn't prefer those either, though. Female satyr are nice and shy in stark contrast with the males, for instance. A shy fey is still a fey, so you'd have to come up with a good excuse as to why is she even more withdrawn than average, unless you'd roleplay out a lot of unmentionables. They have... quite the drive.
4.: Grab your copy of Cityscape and paradigm shift your adventure into roleplay galore for a while! He will still make use of his aura(such as calming down rioters or panicked crowds), but no combat feat breaks a campaign low on combat.
Grogg of the North
Adventurer
One thing I have to ask, you're having the calm emotions affect his allies too, right? And you're enforcing the oath and penalty on his allies too? I've always had it that the party needs to agree to Vow of Peace since it alters a lot of the game play.
If you're still looking for combat, undead hordes work great. Players can hack them to bits and you get to fulfill the vow when you go after the cultists/necromancers.
Otherwise, you can always start combat with archers.
If you're still looking for combat, undead hordes work great. Players can hack them to bits and you get to fulfill the vow when you go after the cultists/necromancers.
Otherwise, you can always start combat with archers.
frankthedm
First Post
Just explain you were mistaken to the group to allow that book. Remove it and let the affected PCs rebuild characters. You are new at this, you don't need the extra work. That book is the problem, not only can it ramp up character power putting more work on the DM, it puts even more work on the DM since they have to watch the exalted characters for alignment and Vow violations. Then the DM also has to enforce the penalties for those violations which can be a source of grief for the whole group. BTW, double check the text of the Vows, IIRC Vow violations can't be Atoned for, though Alignment violations can.
James the Newbie
First Post
To not totally nerf him, if you make an average of 1/4 encounters immune to his aura. Then his ability is generally useful, as it should be, but at-least you can start to work some combat back into your campaign.
frankthedm's suggestion is reasonable and fair, if you are having too much trouble with the character, after a session if you take him aside, and explain to him you are struggling to deal with his character, because it is so good, complimenting the player, but explaining it put's too much stress on you, then requesting he shifts his character to something else, however on the other hand, if a player works hard and finds something that they like, you should only take it from them as a last resort.
frankthedm's suggestion is reasonable and fair, if you are having too much trouble with the character, after a session if you take him aside, and explain to him you are struggling to deal with his character, because it is so good, complimenting the player, but explaining it put's too much stress on you, then requesting he shifts his character to something else, however on the other hand, if a player works hard and finds something that they like, you should only take it from them as a last resort.
Thank you.
Several of the suggestions here are excellent. I appreciate all your help. They are currently in an undead dungeon (cuts back on his aura a little). The party is quite upset with having to roll will saves to see if they can attack things (so yes I made the party also roll) and are probably going to kill his character if I don't keep him somewhat useful to them. I redesigned the Diplomacy check so that he couldn't use it to turn everything into an ally. I like the idea of bringing his Fey into the game to give a little plot twist. Thank you again.
Several of the suggestions here are excellent. I appreciate all your help. They are currently in an undead dungeon (cuts back on his aura a little). The party is quite upset with having to roll will saves to see if they can attack things (so yes I made the party also roll) and are probably going to kill his character if I don't keep him somewhat useful to them. I redesigned the Diplomacy check so that he couldn't use it to turn everything into an ally. I like the idea of bringing his Fey into the game to give a little plot twist. Thank you again.
The bravery is in owning up to the mistake in the first place.
Interestingly, pansies are actually pretty hardy plants. I sometimes wonder why everyone uses their name as synonymous with weakness.
In any event, standing before your friends/gaming group, and telling them you screwed up and as a result they'll have to change is no pleasant walk in the park. And removing the source of the problem *is* fixing the problem.
Not lying to yourself and others when it makes no sense files under basic logic in my book, but I guess it can depend on who we're talking about. I'm afraid of the silliest things, after all.
Sure it does. I'm saying it's a too easy way out. You have to set standards as to how far you'll go to achieve X. In social interaction, being everyone's *beeep* will generally end with you in the dog house. Add the factor of forcing the players to change their chars while you act like a saint, and they'll hate you for it exactly because it's nice, thus they have no say in the matter unless they're willing to look like an ass while defending a perfectly valid point. A fair example of Nice≠Good.
I'm more than happy you liked the idea!
So long it's no trouble, please keep me/us informed how the game goes.
