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DMG Confuzzed - CR Question ... Multiple Monsters
- Thread starter Angelsboi
- Start date
Wulf Ratbane
Adventurer
Angelsboi said:
Disclaimer: I don't have my DMG in front of me, unfortunately.
For the three xCR2 encounter, I would look under the matched pair column: two CR2's = EL4, match that with the last CR2, thus look in the 2 + 4 column.
Four xCR2 is EL6. Every time you double the number of creatures, you add +2 to the EL.
1 x CR2 = EL2
2 x CR2 = EL4
4 x CR2 = EL6
8 x CR2 = EL8
16 x CR2 = EL10
Wulf
CR is CR and doesn't change, it is a rating for each individual creature. What you are probably looking for is the EL (encounter level) as to how challenging encountering multiple creatures can be. There is a table in the DMG (sorry, I don't remember the page number, I don't have the books at work
) that gives a way of figuring out how much of a challenge a number of each monsters are. Some smart person with the books will probably come along and give the page number for you, people are so freindly here
) that gives a way of figuring out how much of a challenge a number of each monsters are. Some smart person with the books will probably come along and give the page number for you, people are so freindly here
Psion
Adventurer
No, it does not.
First off, a creature's CR doesn't change by adding more creatures. However, the encounter level, EL, does. For one creature, EL=CR. For two (of the same CR), EL=CR+2.
Doubling the number of creatures adds two to the EL. It's a logarithmic scale.
I worked out a table from the table in the DMG that shows how to modify EL for numbers. IIRC, it goes something like this:
# EL
1 CR
2 CR+2
3 CR+3
4 CR+4
5-6 CR+5
7-9 CR+6
10-12 CR+7
It gets more difficult when adding creatures with different CR's, but if you want, you can use this spreadsheet, assuming you have excel or quattro pro. (If anyone wants the details on how I worked this out, I can share... but it's sorta mathematical.):
(attachment removed. Lemme know if you want it... but due to MS inbedding certain info in their documents, I don't feel comfortable leaving it out there...)
First off, a creature's CR doesn't change by adding more creatures. However, the encounter level, EL, does. For one creature, EL=CR. For two (of the same CR), EL=CR+2.
Doubling the number of creatures adds two to the EL. It's a logarithmic scale.
I worked out a table from the table in the DMG that shows how to modify EL for numbers. IIRC, it goes something like this:
# EL
1 CR
2 CR+2
3 CR+3
4 CR+4
5-6 CR+5
7-9 CR+6
10-12 CR+7
It gets more difficult when adding creatures with different CR's, but if you want, you can use this spreadsheet, assuming you have excel or quattro pro. (If anyone wants the details on how I worked this out, I can share... but it's sorta mathematical.):
(attachment removed. Lemme know if you want it... but due to MS inbedding certain info in their documents, I don't feel comfortable leaving it out there...)
Last edited:
Joshua Randall
Legend
DMG, page 101, Table 4-1: Encounter Numbers.
According to the paragraph that begins the second column on page 101, "To determine the Encounter Level [EL] of a group of monsters, reverse these steps (begin with the number of creatures, read down to find the CR for the creature type, then look left to find the appropriate EL)."
Applying this paragraph's instructions to the CR 2 examples given by Angelsboi in his original message, we get some slightly different results depending upon how you want to read the table. The problem is that a lot of the columns have both "1 or 2" and "2" as the CR. [I see Psion has beat me to the punch with a solution, so I'll stop now.]
According to the paragraph that begins the second column on page 101, "To determine the Encounter Level [EL] of a group of monsters, reverse these steps (begin with the number of creatures, read down to find the CR for the creature type, then look left to find the appropriate EL)."
Applying this paragraph's instructions to the CR 2 examples given by Angelsboi in his original message, we get some slightly different results depending upon how you want to read the table. The problem is that a lot of the columns have both "1 or 2" and "2" as the CR. [I see Psion has beat me to the punch with a solution, so I'll stop now.]
Ridley's Cohort
First Post
There is a big disconnect to watch for. While there are lots of rules and guidance for ELs, by the DMG, EL has nothing to do with xp awards.
4 ogres in one fight give the exact same experience as fighting 4 different 1-ogre battles. Of course that is loopy, but it is what the rules say.
"Officially" ELs are guidelines for letting the DM know if a battle is too tough or too easy for a particular party, and nothing else.
In practice, I would recommend giving bonus xp for ELs that are higher than the effective party EL. (You can guestimate the party EL using the same rules as for monsters and NPCs).
4 ogres in one fight give the exact same experience as fighting 4 different 1-ogre battles. Of course that is loopy, but it is what the rules say.
"Officially" ELs are guidelines for letting the DM know if a battle is too tough or too easy for a particular party, and nothing else.
In practice, I would recommend giving bonus xp for ELs that are higher than the effective party EL. (You can guestimate the party EL using the same rules as for monsters and NPCs).
