DMG Excerpt: Customizing Monsters

[small pumpkin man]

Can someone post that awesome ninjae vs Einstein pic again? Thx.

You mean this?

 

[Spatula]

So you can produce solos this way basically.

The warning about making weak solo monsters with templates is spot-on, I would think. Elites have 2x the hp of a "normal" monster, solos have 5x. What we can see in the two templates here is that they upgrade a normal monster to elite status but! instead of doubling its HP, they add on a new stack of HP derived from the template's monster role, which is kinda neat. (although I'm a bit confused about what you get if the monster's role and the template's differ, or what makes a lich a controller vs an artillery) So if you add a template to an elite, or two templates to a normal monster, you end up with a solo monster that effectively has 3x the normal hp, instead of 5x. Which is a rather large difference.

Probably a good way around this would be to double the base creature's hp when adding a template to an elite creature (whether it started off as elite or was made into one by another template). That would give you an effective 5x hp total.

Also the new solo creature should have 2 action points? Ah nevermind, Sojurn answered this.

 

[TwinBahamut]

Einstein vs. Ninjas is one of those images that will never stop being awesome. I still can't believe it exists...

Anyways, I like today's preview. The new template scheme works really well, and I like both the Lich and the vampire Lord. My only complaint is that the description about how to switch out armor is noticeably less elegant than most other things we have seen about the game. It doesn't sit well with me. Fortunately, I see little need to actually use those rules very often.

 

[Sojorn]

Also the new solo creature should have 2 action points?

Gets one from each template or 1 from elite and 1 from template.

 

[Vaeron]

I'm sure someone well tell me I've overlooked something, but there's what seems to be a big inconsistency around the middle of the page, talking about monster magic threshhold. In one paragraph, it says

"For example, if you give that 8th-level ogre savage a +2 magic greatclub, you add only a +1 bonus to its attack rolls and damage rolls, since its magic threshold is +1."

But almost immediately thereafter it says

" For example, those ogre savages in plate armor and wielding +3 greatswords have AC, attack rolls, and damage rolls three points higher than normal."

Ok, the +3 to AC I get... That's from the upgrade to plate armor. But we were just told, not two paragraphs earlier, that they would NOT get a +3 to attack and damage because their threshhold allows only a +1.

So how could the author then go on to make such a mistake? Like I said, I'm sure I'm overlooking something, like I did when I failed to notice the entire Constitution score added to PC hitpoints and not just Con modifier.

Edit: I see now that the threshhold is *subtracted* from the enhancement bonus, but the numbers still don't add up. +3 -1 = +2

 

[cferejohn]

I noticed that too...

I'm sure someone well tell me I've overlooked something, but there's what seems to be a big inconsistency around the middle of the page, talking about monster magic threshhold. In one paragraph, it says

"For example, if you give that 8th-level ogre savage a +2 magic greatclub, you add only a +1 bonus to its attack rolls and damage rolls, since its magic threshold is +1."

But almost immediately thereafter it says

" For example, those ogre savages in plate armor and wielding +3 greatswords have AC, attack rolls, and damage rolls three points higher than normal."

Ok, the +3 to AC I get... That's from the upgrade to plate armor. But we were just told, not two paragraphs earlier, that they would NOT get a +3 to attack and damage because their threshhold allows only a +1.

Yeah, glad I'm not the only one who noticed that. Seemed pretty glaring. It seems more like that should be a sidebar "behind the scenes" for *why* they instituted that rule.

I wonder if there is going to be a similar mechanic for players. Only powerful heroes can get the most out of their magic weapons and armor, which makes as much sense as anything else, and works well from a balance perspective. Also, it allows the DM to place some super powerful quest weapon in the PCs hands or for a character to inherit the sword of his powerful father use it without it taking over the campaign.

 

[Spatula]

Another intersting tidbit is that raising or lowering a monsters level has a direct effect on its damage, by 1/2 damage per level. I'm sure it's just a handwave (note that none of the monster upgrade paths involve altering the monster's ability scores), but grist for the +half-your-level-to-damage discussion, nonetheless...

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

And now, for some silliness.
[sblock]Succubus Vampire Lord Level 11 Elite Controller
Medium immortal humanoid (devil, shapechanger, undead) XP 1200
Initiative +8 Senses Perception +8; darkvision
HP 204; Bloodied 102
AC 27; Fortitude 21, Reflex 25, Will 27
Immune disease, poison
Resist 20 fire 10 necrotic
Vulnerable radiant 10
Saving Throws +2
Action Point 1
Regeneration 10 (regeneration does not function while the succubus vampire lord is exposed to direct sunlight)
Speed 6, fly 6

Melee Corrupting Touch (standard; at-will)
+16 vs. AC; 1d6 + 7 damage.

Melee Charming Kiss (standard; at-will) Charm
+16 vs. AC; on a hit, the succubus vampire lord makes a secondary attack against the same target. Secondary Attack: +14 vs. Will; the target cannot attack the succubus vampire lord, and if the target is adjacent to the succubus vampire lord when the succubus vampire lord is targeted by a melee or a ranged attack, the target interposes itself and becomes the target of the attack instead. The effects last until the succubus vampire lord or one of its allies attacks the target or until the succubus vampire lord dies.

If the target is still under the effect of this power at the end of the encounter, the succubus vampire lord can sustain the effect indefinitely by kissing the target once per day. The succubus vampire lord can affect only one target at a time with its charming kiss.

Ranged Dominate (standard; at-will) Charm
Ranged 5; +14 vs. Will; the target is dominated until the end of the succubus vampire lord’s next turn.

Melee Blood Drain (standard, encounter; recharges when an adjacent creature becomes bloodied) Healing
Requires combat advantage. +13 vs. Fortitude; 2d12 + 10, and the target is weakened (save ends), and the succubus vampire lord heals 51 hit points.

Ranged Dominating Gaze (minor, recharge 6) Charm
Ranged 5; +13 vs. Will; the target is dominated (save ends, with a –2 penalty to the saving throw). Aftereffect: The target is dazed (save ends). The succubus vampire lord can dominate only one creature at a time with this power.

Mist Form (standard; encounter) Polymorph
The vampire lord becomes insubstantial and gains a fly speed of 12, but cannot make attacks. The succubus vampire lord can remain in mist form for up to 1 hour or end the effect as a minor action.

Change Shape (minor; at-will) Polymorph
The succubus can alter its physical form to take on the appearance of any Medium humanoid, including a unique individual (see Change Shape, page 280).

Alignment Evil Languages Common, Supernal
Skills Bluff +15, Diplomacy +15, Insight +13
Str 11 (+4) Dex 18 (+8) Wis 19 (+8)
Con 10 (+4) Int 15 (+6) Cha 22 (+10)[/sblock]

Nasty. Very nasty.
After two combat rounds, I see two PCs dominated, one charmed.
Better hope the remaining two have a break enchantment-like spell ready...

 

[cferejohn]

Edit: I see now that the threshhold is *subtracted* from the enhancement bonus, but the numbers still don't add up. +3 -1 = +2

Umm, I don't think so. That would mean that high level monsters would get *less* use out of their magic items.

 

[Lurker59]

I agree. It seems like it should be +2 to hit and damage rolls from wielding +3 greatswords, due to the +1 threshold. It is also possible that the ogre usually uses a greatclub and the greatsword has +1 proficiency and average damage when compared to the greatclub. If that is the case a +3 greatsword would provide +3 hit and damage. Even so the example should be a little more clear about the details.