DMG Intro Adventure - Big Spoiler!

[Boco]

No, it says "before the start of your next turn"... which means only in the round after you used your Divine Challenge.

This has been eratta'd by CustServ. The intent is that the challenge is reapplied every turn even without the minor action, unless you want to change targets or you break the challenge yourself by failing to engage. So the way to read it should be "the first time each turn" rather than "the first time before the start of your next turn".

 

[Tellerve]

If I am reading this correctly I think you or your DM works Divine Challenge incorrectly. It does damage each round that the target is marked and chooses to attack something besides the paladin ( and of course the paladin keeps engaging it )

First, I'm not doing it incorrectly, Archus is, which is why I put my question up there to try and have him explain it without outright telling him he was wrong. But then you quoted me, and still have it wrong.

It isn't each round, read the power again. It says the first attack it takes radiant damage before the start of your next turn.

Also, you can't cheese it by putting the Divine Challenge on round after round on the same creature as it explicitly says you can't put a DC on a creature that you've already put DC on.

EDIT: A'ight, well Boco, just informed me that CustSrv has said that it continues on preceeding rounds and allows the first attack of each round for the creature to be smacked by some radiant damage. News to me. Thanks Also, sorry Archus, you apparently are doing it correctly

 

[On Puget Sound]

I'm running two parallel groups on alternate Mondays, and being a lazy GM I'm using the same adventures for both, at least to start. Group A has entered Kobold Hall and made it through Skull-Skull. Along the way they captured and interrogated a slinger, so they know there is a white dragon. It will be interesting to see whether foreknowledge is enough to make a difference. I don't see much of a consequence for taking an extended rest after the wyrmpriest; the dragon may wonder why no one has brought in food or tribute today, but I doubt he'll squeeze up the passageway to attack.

(Incidentally, I am adding a hole in the ceiling of his cave... he has to get in and out somehow!)

Group B spent their first session entirely on exploring Fallcrest, getting to know each other, and arranging to get every NPC in town, separately, to pay them for clearing out the kobolds. So they enter the Hall today.

 

[samursus]

My group had 6 pc's, but they had an extended rest beforehand, as the Fighter had dided in the previous encounter, so they had to go back to Fallcrest to Raise him. They took out the dragon fairly easily if I remember correctly. The fighter and paladin engaged on one side while the rogue was on the other, stepping in and out for Combat Advantage. The Wizard didn't do much, and the Warlock and Ranged Ranger attacked from afar. The Dragon only recharged his breath once (on bloodied), and missed his attack on the only 2 within range.

They had a waaay easier time than I thought they would have. One thing I have noticed is how swingy this edition is, especially without a Leader in the group. Later on in KotS, there was almost a TPK at the Dragon Burial Site (extra Guardian Drake added for parity) and the 2 Defenders died.

 

[KarinsDad]

Our group crushed this adventure at first level. One PC fell unconscious in the third fight. One PC fell unconscious in the Dragon fight.

Dragonborn Paladin, Eladrin Warlock, Human Wizard, Dwarven Cleric, Elven Ranger

I think one key to 4E survival is to take advantage of situational rules. For example, have the Defender up front defending, but have lower AC non-melee PCs behind cover (including the cover of other higher AC PCs). In the case of the Dragon encounter, the PCs have to spread out all over the room to prevent too many of them from getting hit with the breathe weapon simultaneously.

Also, using up Daily powers too early results in them not being available later on. Dailies should be used in the first or second overwhelming fight of the day, but should rarely be used in a more typical fight. We probably had 3 Dailies stlll available for the Dragon fight.

But the main key to me for taking on a powerful encounter like the Dragon one is for all PCs to have an Action Point available for that encounter. I have discouraged my fellow players from using Action Points haphazardly or just when they feel like it, for example, just because they missed in an encounter with an attack (which was happening). Action Points should be used when it gives the group a significant advantage.

Course, I have to admit that the DM had some bad dice rolls with the Dragon. He missed on maybe 2/3rds of the Breathe Weapon attacks (he rolls to hit and damage rolls out in front of the group). So, we did have a better than average Action Enconomy in that fight than we typically would have (i.e. attacking instead of healing, attacking instead of helping an ally, etc.).

 

[Tellerve]

I'd say you got off lucky if the dragon was missing that often.

As for the hole in the roof of the cave, I'm totally going to have that as well. Glad I'm not the only one that thought it needed that. I also have been thinking about a skill challenge, or somehow set it up that perhaps they can figure out that the wyrmpriest and kobolds were about to take a offering to the dragon, and instead take it themselves. Do a little parley and maybe get the dragon convinced they'll bring back something good for them...like meat, as it says in the Monster Manual. Heck, kobold bodies! Although the dragon might not be so keen on that one.

In any case, just something to allow them an out perhaps so that they can leave and lick their wounds if they moved into that encounter not fully prepared.

Also thinking of having there be some sort of elemental cold rock or some hunk of magically cold something in the cave, which is one of the reasons the white dragon likes the places. And that is what Nimozaran is after, or something like that...still a work in progress.

EDIT: It has been mentioned, but the white dragon has 32 more hit points than the Monster Manual one, and its Reflex saving throw is 2 points too high, should be a Reflex 16, not 18.

 

[Old Gumphrey]

TPK - the dragon beat everyone on initiative, flew up

Flew up where?

If he's close enough to attack with a reach 2, any fighter worth his salt could jump up and smack him with a weapon.

Plus, you can ready an action to attack the dragon when he attacks you. I mean, he's biting you, right? That means he's thrusting his own face toward you. If that's not a valid target, I don't know what is.

 

[Fundin Strongarm]

Flew up where?

If he's close enough to attack with a reach 2, any fighter worth his salt could jump up and smack him with a weapon.

Plus, you can ready an action to attack the dragon when he attacks you. I mean, he's biting you, right? That means he's thrusting his own face toward you. If that's not a valid target, I don't know what is.

I imagine he means "flew up to land right in front of the party." I think this can even happen during a surprise round if you haven't perceived the dragon is there (or maybe that was just my DM?). At any rate, it looks like it was first in initiative and did it's breath and fright abilities and burned action points to lay the smack down. With the breath weapon recharging fast, damage can be dealt pretty quickly, forcing people to use Second Wind instead of engaging.

 

[Caliban]

Flew up where?

If he's close enough to attack with a reach 2, any fighter worth his salt could jump up and smack him with a weapon.

Plus, you can ready an action to attack the dragon when he attacks you. I mean, he's biting you, right? That means he's thrusting his own face toward you. If that's not a valid target, I don't know what is.

It didn't fly "up" anywhere in a literal sense, more in the sense that you "run up to someone". It beat everyone on initiative. Then it moved from the center of the room to the 10' wide hallway where the party was standing, breathed on us for 15 points (hitting 5 out of 6 people), hit us with a free action Fear aura (stunning 3 out of 6 people), action surged, and then attacked the rogue 3 times (dropping him).

The fighter and the wizard was stunned and couldn't do anything on their turn. The ranger shot him, action surged, and missed with his daily power. The cleric and the warlord healed people, and the cleric missed with his daily, and the warlord got hit moving up to the dragon. The rogue was up at this point. The fighter and the rogue saved against the fear, weakness, and slow effects. The wizard did not.

The dragon breathed again (for 19 points, I don't remember exactly who got hit), moved away, and the rogue and the fighter moved to engage, the fighter action surges, and misses with his daily power, but is able to get into flank position with the rogue. He also spends a 2nd wind. The cleric and the warlord healed people (they are now out of minor action healing surge powers), and missed with their attack powers (a daily and an encounter). The wizard and the ranger did ranged attacks, doing signficant damage.

The dragon attempts to move away to go after the ranger, but the fighter hits him with his combat challenge attack, and then the OA-stopping his movement. The dragon then breathes again on the warlord, rogue, and cleric, and spends an action point to attack the fighter - hitting 3 times, an one of them a crit. A total of 30 points. The fighter drops, and the rogue is now unable to flank.

After that the dragon pretty much dropped 1-2 people a round, chasing down those who tried to flee.

 

[Dalzig]

Fear Aura? The white dragon doesn't have a fear aura... He does have Frightful Prescence, which is a standard action.

How did the Warlord get hit moving up to the dragon? Only creatures with Threatening Reach get ranged OAs.

Did the player's wait until the -2 to attacks was gone before using their dailies?

And really, breathing every round is slightly evil as a DM.

On a side note: I'm really thinking about letting action points either give a reroll or bonus (ala 3.5).