Do prestige classes count toward XP penalties?
- Thread starter mirivor
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Hypersmurf
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mirivor said:
They don't - the line was erroneously left out of the DMG, but it's been officially confirmed that it works like it did in 3E.
-Hyp.
Hypersmurf
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Thanee said:We play it like they do, however, which makes all that PrC multiclassing a bit more tricky and gives humans and half-elves a real advantage with their favored class.
Ouch. It makes most PrCs difficult.
Mystic Theurge? 3 levels of Cleric, 3 levels of Wizard, 1 level of Mystic Theurge.
If you're an elf, your Wizard levels aren't considered. But Cleric and Theurge are unbalanced, so you take the 20% XP hit at Theurge 1, and from Theurge 5 onwards.
If you're human or half-elf, your highest levelled class isn't considered. Either way, you still end up with something unbalanced with Theurge, and take the 20% XP hit for one level. Once the Theurge hits level 4, it's your highest class, so you're okay from there.
And if you take the class with any other core race, both Wizard and Cleric are unbalanced with Theurge. You take a 20% XP hit at Theurge 1, and a 40% XP hit from Theurge 5 onwards.
Nasty.
-Hyp.
Thanee
First Post
Yeah, we have a human mystic theurge, and even he had one level with multiclassing penalties 3/3/1.
Our centaur fighter always faces multiclass penalties (monster class, fighter class). He knew it before he made the choice.
However, since we give more XP to lower levels, it isn't as bad as it sounds.
And it gives an advantage to players without prestige classes, which is a good thing, IMHO, since generally speaking prestige classes are simply more powerful than base classes, so it's fair, that there is a price to pay.
It also makes the favored class actually meaningful.
Bye
Thanee
Our centaur fighter always faces multiclass penalties (monster class, fighter class). He knew it before he made the choice.
However, since we give more XP to lower levels, it isn't as bad as it sounds.
And it gives an advantage to players without prestige classes, which is a good thing, IMHO, since generally speaking prestige classes are simply more powerful than base classes, so it's fair, that there is a price to pay.
It also makes the favored class actually meaningful.
Bye
Thanee
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Ottergame
First Post
While they may still be powerful, the multiclass experience penalty is not balancing. The multiclass experience penalty is keep players from dabling in base classes, that have no requirments, to become more powerful though min-maxing. Prestige classes already have a different form of limitation to prevent min-maxing... prerequisites. It's very difficult for a low level character to meet enough requirements for most prestige classes to be able to enter more than one before he hits level 8 or so. So in effect, a player who tries to meet the entry requirements for 2 or 3 presitge classes is screwed at low levels as he spends feats, skills, and spells to meet prerequisites that include often times very lame and useless feats and skills, and then he isscrewed after he starts taking the classes by becoming gimped with an unnessicary experience penalty.
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Thanee
First Post
Well, I honestly don't see a big difference between multiclassing between base classes and prestige classes.
Sometimes, Prestige Classes are very similar to a base class and could be seen as an "extension" of that class, rather than actual multiclassing, but often, this is not the case, and there really is no difference between multiclassing into another base class or the prestige class then.
However, the requirements are rarely a real hindrance (only for exceptionally weak PrC), as they often include skills and feats, which you pick anyways, and simply set a minimum level at which your character can start evolving into that class. Only, if you want to qualify for multiple prestige classes, but that's nothing I find should be made easy, really. Prestige classes are still something special and shouldn't be racked up just to tap the power of several of them.
Prestige classes are generally better, but also have requirements to balance this. But what balances a character without prestige classes against a character with prestige classes (i.e. a straight wizard versus a wizard/<arcane prestige class>). The requirements? Hardly. That's where the multiclass penalty (house rule!) comes into play. Works for us, doesn't have to for you.
Bye
Thanee
Sometimes, Prestige Classes are very similar to a base class and could be seen as an "extension" of that class, rather than actual multiclassing, but often, this is not the case, and there really is no difference between multiclassing into another base class or the prestige class then.
However, the requirements are rarely a real hindrance (only for exceptionally weak PrC), as they often include skills and feats, which you pick anyways, and simply set a minimum level at which your character can start evolving into that class. Only, if you want to qualify for multiple prestige classes, but that's nothing I find should be made easy, really. Prestige classes are still something special and shouldn't be racked up just to tap the power of several of them.
Prestige classes are generally better, but also have requirements to balance this. But what balances a character without prestige classes against a character with prestige classes (i.e. a straight wizard versus a wizard/<arcane prestige class>). The requirements? Hardly. That's where the multiclass penalty (house rule!) comes into play. Works for us, doesn't have to for you.
Bye
Thanee
