Do "they" exist in your world?

[s/LaSH]

Yes, they exist, much the same way they do now. That is to say, I'm staring down the barrel of an electron cannon as I type; but I don't think 'damn, those're some nice electrons' at the time, nor do I ever really think that.

In my main campaign world, physics operates just as you'd expect it to, with the addition of magic and some elemental planes. I'll consider the semipermeable cell membranes of trollish protoplasm, the ritual proliferation of divine magic styles, and the relative advances of both magic and technology (an important factor, actually; they take roughly the same role in society, and operate on roughly the same principle of investigation and sophistication, so I curbed magic down to a medieval level, rather than the default D&D magic level, which could be best described as Star Trek in technological terms). And this will lead to some truly awesome things later on, which my players aren't suspecting at all...

 

[Kelleris]

Probably, although with a caveat similar to Nifft's.

 

[Dogbrain]

You know, in classical Greece, the four elements that the world was supposedly created from where differentiated in that each was made of non-divisible particles ("atoms") that resembled the four regular solids known at the time.

You're mixing a couple of systems. Democritian and Epicurian atomism didn't put much stock in the elements and elementalism didn't agree with the existence of atoms. This isn't to say they couldn't be combined.

It may be that such a combination was behind the five-element system of some forms of medievial/Renaissance metaphysics, with the fifth element called "Quintessence"--or the "element from which the elements are made".

I once read a book called "The Book of Quintessence", which gave instructions on how to make pure Quintessence, which could be used to ensure feelings of well-being. The instructions amounted to repeated distillations of wine...

 

[jeffers]

Why, yes... they do...

But they are explained away as "concurrencies of the local magic field" or somesuch... until a PC asks or I have a drunk nano-minded mage sitting around wanting to be heard... I don't think I'll have to worry about it... Unless the following argument would be more fun than ignoring it...

"Atoms!" says Bohr

"Monads!" says Leibnitz

"ATOMS!" insists Bohr...

"MO...NADS!" festers Leibnitz...

"FIRE...BALL!" says Mordenkainen

"Oh bother... " intones Chorus (Played so very admirably by Sir Derek Jacobi, BTW)

 

[WayneLigon]

In most D&D games I've run, no; everything is generally composed at some level of Air, Earth, Fire, Water, and/or Spirit. The proportion depends on the thing itself; seawater obviously has very little Earth in it, but it has some, just enough to give it mass and physical weight. Fire is the purest element (seen in how it is intangible, yet can affect other things, and how it purifies a wound).

I have run a few 'grim and gritty' games with more 'scientific' rules of magic just so I could get cute throwaway lines like from Thieve's World, where one of the sorceresses says she gave a man she disliked a nasty little bug that lives in his spine and will plague him the rest of his days (refering to herpes, of course).

 

[Nightfall]

They always exist. If they didn't, people would be like "Where are they!?!"

 

[Gez]

In my homebrew, I guess the answer would be "probably, but who is going to know that anyway?"

I mean, gluball and pentaquarks are fun, but whether you make it through magic or through technology (or both together), a particle accelerator is needed to detect them. So you first need to have people get the idea of accelerating particles.

While real-life science works, magic is usually much more efficient. Who would bother creating a determinist model of climatic variation when you can't observe a climate that isn't set by the spirit of the land, and tampered with by druids? In a world with teleport, which Einstein would say that nothing can accelerate past the speed of light?

Science (by which I mean the corpus of ideas and way of thinking associated with the scientific mindset) just don't work the same way. For example, IMC, there are theories on how the universe works. But these theories must deal with more than the material plane, for they have to deal with the inner, outer, and transitive planes too.

IMC, I've used the concept of dimensions. No one can perceive the whole universe, only partial aspects of it. Mortals, in particular, are limited to the perception of 3½ dimensions: 3 of space, and one half of time. Through magic, however, it is possible to modify the dimensions perceived.

The elemental plane of fire is the dimension of fire, in that it is a cross-section of all the fire element of the universe. Its three spacial dimensions are not the three geometric dimensions of the material plane, but will be interpreted the same way by the mind. Likewise for the planes of water, air, earth...

The ethereal, astral, and shadow planes are other cross-sections of the universe.

The Far Realms are outside of the universe, and don't have dimensions. It has things that could be called pseudodimensions, but they don't work the same way dimension do (and it is possible they don't work at all, in fact), and a mind can't interpret them.

 

[Bendris Noulg]

I've been using this for about the last 5 years...

 

[Nifft]

Some other things that I forgot about my model:
- Magic is sentient.
- Nothing is possible without observation.
- There is no such thing as non-sentient automation.

In other words, if a tree falls in the forest, and no-one's around, it does NOT make a noise -- in fact, it can't even fall! (This is why the forest is full of Fey: to keep Nature working right.)

Spells are sentient. (This is why a Magic Missile will always hit. It knows who you want it to hit. This is also why very high-level spells -- such as Wish -- come with a natural language interface, and have the intelligence to twist your meaning to make their brief lives easier.)

No dumb automation: you could build a factory, but you'd have to man each machine. No steam powered unmanned labor -- it simply won't work. You can create magical constructs to do work, because they eat XP -- you're effectively breaking off part of your soul to craft a new sentient creature, which can then operate on its own. (This is why most complex traps are magical -- magic is sentient, so it will work even when you're not around.)

-- N

 

[TheAuldGrump]

They exist, and in less than 400 years people will even know about them! (It being around 1630 or so technology wise.)

Magic is a field effect, and a biproduct of people's beliefs - in a place with a strong centralized religion this is sharply focused - divine magic functions, arcane magic is inverse in power to the belief in the central faith. And that strong central religion is crumbling... Magic has returned. (And in some areas it never went away...)

Chemistry has almost reached the discovery of caked gunpowder, meal powder is in common use. And astrology is just as effective as it is in this world. (Which is to say, so vague you can read whatever the heck you like into it...)

I also worked out some of the genetics to my world, enough to interest me and bore my playeres. (I have mentioned this on previous threads, don't think I'll go into it here.)

The Auld Grump, and with the return of magic so return Dragons!