Does SR protect your Mirror Images?

[KarinsDad]

Or if he wants to spend a 5th level slot casting a quickened MM, same thing goes. Either way, Mirror Images has a good chance at protecting you, it'll do so for a round or two at the beginning of combat, and that's good enough for me.

How about the 6th level slot for casting a quickened Mirrror Image?

Faster than the one character can knock them out, the other character can restore them.

Plus, this does not even take into account Empowered Mirror Image which I think WotC ruled against being allowed to happen, but it is still allowed by RAW I think (I don't recall there being special wording against it).

(D4+4)*1.5 images or 12 max images.

 

[Felix]

What KarinsDad said.

Ok, so we assume knowledgeable foes who know there's an enemy arcanist about.

Seeing a single mage standing there doesn't mean he doesn't have protections up that will thwart readied actions. He could have a Wind Wall or Prot. From Arrows to thwart archers. He could have Displacement up. He could be invisible, and what you're seeing is a Major Image.

Which is not to say that intelligent enemies won't realize that it is harder to ready against a Mirror Imaged caster, but rather that arcane casters will draw fire no matter what they do. And if the enemies are intelligent enought to know that the images wink out if you hit them (cause for a Spellcraft check if Mirror Image had not been encountered before), then they might know about those other protections, and suddenly Readying becomes less appealing.

At least this gives archers a reason to ready Manyshot since the images all have to be close to one another, eh?

 

[Felix]

It's not silly. What is silly is to have different targeting rules for some spells then for others, even though the spells state the same targets.

I will not be held responsible if you stand next to the RAW while I fart in its direction.

And for a general rules set, I agree with you. But ruling it on a case-by-case (or spell-by-spell) has its virtues. Remember our disagreement on Mind Blank and Rary's Telepathic Bond? I'm applying the same kind of spell-by-spell ruling. Either way, a discussion on how silly that is doesn't belong in this thread or this forum.

How about the 6th level slot for casting a quickened Mirrror Image?

By all means, load your arcanist up with 6th-level quickened Mirror Images instead of Chain Lightnings. It's a different flavor for a mage... one who really really doesn't want to die, but isn't as good at killing others. Balances out I think.

 

[Delemental]

But how can you conclude that spells "that cause hit points of damage" are attack spells? IIRC there is no such definition in the rules.

You mean, like this?

Attacks
Some spell descriptions refer to attacking. All offensive combat actions, even those that don’t damage opponents are considered attacks. Attempts to turn or rebuke undead count as attacks. All spells that opponents resist with saving throws, that deal damage, or that otherwise harm or hamper subjects are attacks. Spells that summon monsters or other allies are not attacks because the spells themselves don’t harm anyone.

(Emphasis mine)

So, to borrow from your previous posts, spells like Grease wouldn't pop images (it does hamper the target, but it's cast on an area, not targeted against a person), but technically, by RAW, Daze would dispel an image (assuming that the wizard isn't at 5+ HD, which means that using Daze will only be effective during a very short period in the mage's career).

 

[Shin Okada]

You mean, like this?



(Emphasis mine)

So, to borrow from your previous posts, spells like Grease wouldn't pop images (it does hamper the target, but it's cast on an area, not targeted against a person), but technically, by RAW, Daze would dispel an image (assuming that the wizard isn't at 5+ HD, which means that using Daze will only be effective during a very short period in the mage's career).

Hmm. I doubt if that paragraph is written Mirror Image in mind. The text of Mirror Image is saying "any successful attack. If you include those "attack" spells, how do you determine if it made success or not?

And, I still think spells (other than those with actual attack rolls) are not included. As it says,

Enemies attempting to attack you or cast spells at you must select from among indistinguishable targets.

It seems that "attack" and "cast spells" are different things here.

 

[RigaMortus2]

Magic Missile is not an attack.

Oh really? Cool I can cast Magic Missile while Invisible and not have to worry about invisibility breaking.

 

[Shin Okada]

Oh really? Cool I can cast Magic Missile while Invisible and not have to worry about invisibility breaking.

Well, actually, there is no clear definition of "attack" which can be applicable to all the rules. For some rules (like invisibility spell), Magic Missile is clearlly an attack. But for some rules (say, miss-chance due to visibility) Magic Missile is clearlly not an attack.

In case of Mirror Image, I say a spell which does not involve an attack roll is not an attack.

 

[KarinsDad]

So, to borrow from your previous posts, spells like Grease wouldn't pop images (it does hamper the target, but it's cast on an area, not targeted against a person), but technically, by RAW, Daze would dispel an image (assuming that the wizard isn't at 5+ HD, which means that using Daze will only be effective during a very short period in the mage's career).

Actually, technically by RAW, Daze still will not work.

"Enemies attempting to attack you or cast spells at you must select from among indistinguishable targets."

You can choose to target an image with a spell, but ANY spell that only allows for targeting only a creature will still fizzle and fail because the image is an invalid target. Mirror Image does not state that you can legally target the image with a spell that does not allow for it, it only states that you must select a target from amongst the images.

So Daze will never be effective.

According to RAW.

 

[RigaMortus2]

So, to borrow from your previous posts, spells like Grease wouldn't pop images (it does hamper the target, but it's cast on an area, not targeted against a person), but technically, by RAW, Daze would dispel an image (assuming that the wizard isn't at 5+ HD, which means that using Daze will only be effective during a very short period in the mage's career).

Would the level 0 Sor/Wiz spell Message pop them as well?

 

[Nail]

Well, actually, there is no clear definition of "attack" which can be applicable to all the rules. For some rules (like invisibility spell), Magic Missile is clearlly an attack. But for some rules (say, miss-chance due to visibility) Magic Missile is clearlly not an attack.

Careful. You're spiraling outta control, kid.

You can't target an invisible opponent with a magic missile because you can't see him.

This says nothing about whether magic missle is an attack.