Does the animal companion grow?

[jgsugden]

So as the rules stand at the moment without an Errata or what Andy Collins says, the wolf WILL grow when it hits 4HD?

First of all, no, for all the reasons you ave already been given.

Secondly, it would be a mistake to ignore the comments made by Andy Collins. When the errata is released, most, if not all, of his comments will be reflected int he errata. I'm certain that the major ones, like this one, will be addressed. If you decide to play using a different interpretation of the rules, you'll either need to change your method of play when the errata comes out or make a house rule to run your game using your interpretation. Considering that the game is designed to run smoothly with all the WotC rules in place, too many house rules can create unexpected rules conflicts down the road. It isn't worth the hassle ... just follow the intended rules and save yourself a headache. You'll have more fun in the end.

 

[Pyrex]

(From the SRD)
Bonus HD: Extra eight-sided (d8) Hit Dice, each of which gains a Constitution modifier, as normal. Remember that extra Hit Dice improve the animal companion’s base attack and base save bonuses. An animal companion’s base attack bonus is the same as that of a druid of a level equal to the animal’s HD. An animal companion has good Fortitude and Reflex saves (treat it as a character whose level equals the animal’s HD). An animal companion gains additional skill points and feats for bonus HD as normal for advancing a monster’s Hit Dice.

Lets see. It gains HP, BAB, Saves, Skills and Feats as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice. Logically, since the wolf is gaining animal hit dice, it should get larger once it hits 4HD.

There's only one reason for the wolf not to get larger: Game balance.

Only about three animals on the animal companion list will ever gain enough HD from being an animal companion to become Large. The wolf is the only one of those on the Lvl-1 list. A Large wolf is just too good for a Lvl3 druid.

 

[Spatzimaus]

Lets see. It gains HP, BAB, Saves, Skills and Feats as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice. Logically, since the wolf is gaining animal hit dice, it should get larger once it hits 4HD.

Nowhere in that quote does it say that it gains a monster Hit Die. It explicitly says that it gains a HD that gives d8 HP, 3/4 BAB (as Druid) and good Fortitude and Reflex saves; this is very similar to most Animal HD (some Animals get a good Will save), which is strange since the creature is a Magical Beast, but it did NOT just say "advance the creature one HD". The only part where it says "as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice" is the number of skill points it receives.
The same debate has come up many times for Paladin mounts (especially once you add the DotF "exotic mount" rules). These critters don't gain in size, because they're not actually gaining Advancement HD, any more than someone who takes a class level is. They're gaining "Animal Companion HD", which just happen to give the same HP, BAB, etc. as an Animal. If a Dragon takes 20 class levels, is he suddenly 500 years older and twice as large?

 

[billd91]

Lets see. It gains HP, BAB, Saves, Skills and Feats as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice. Logically, since the wolf is gaining animal hit dice, it should get larger once it hits 4HD.

There's only one reason for the wolf not to get larger: Game balance.

Only about three animals on the animal companion list will ever gain enough HD from being an animal companion to become Large. The wolf is the only one of those on the Lvl-1 list. A Large wolf is just too good for a Lvl3 druid.

No, no, no. Where in that passage quoted from the SRD does it say it also gains SIZE as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice? Nowhere. It delineates hp, BAB, Saves, Skills, and Feats. And that's it. No size. No stat increases because of size.
Note also that the animal companion gains stat modifiers, including natural armor, on a specifically different schedule than through size-changing
monster advancement.

 

[jgsugden]

Just to be clear on this:

Andy Collins has stated his opinion on how all of this was intended to work. You are free to think that his comments have no effects on the rules as they stand, but it is very likely that any errata will make the rules conform to his statements on the subject. In other words, if you want to use the official rules as they are released, you might as well follow his advice now so that you don't need to switch when the errata is released.

He said that animals do *not* grow when they advance as animal companions. They gain HD, BAB, save bonuses, feats (1/3 HD), skills (1/lvl) and bonus ability points (1/4 HD). The failure to mention bonus ability points was an accidental oversight.

Also, one final note on growth: Some possible animal companions do not have specified animal advancement capable of dealing with the accumulation of animal companion hit dice. For instance, a dire rat's progression is listed through 6 HD. A 9th level druid with a dire rat animal companion would be off the 'growth' charts. The failure to include growth possibilities to handle advancement as animal companions is another strong indicator that animal companions are not intended to grow.

 

[Christian]

Also, one final note on growth: Some possible animal companions do not have specified animal advancement capable of dealing with the accumulation of animal companion hit dice. For instance, a dire rat's progression is listed through 6 HD. A 9th level druid with a dire rat animal companion would be off the 'growth' charts. The failure to include growth possibilities to handle advancement as animal companions is another strong indicator that animal companions are not intended to grow.

Of course, that leaves the option of going with the house rule and extending the animal advancement charts accordingly. "Hi, I'm Vadania, the 20th-level druid. And this is my good friend Spike, the 20' long, 4-ton wolf. Don't worry, he doesn't bite."

 

[Zaruthustran]

Well, the FAQ didn't have any mention of druids and animal companions.

SRD says this under "THE DRUID’S ANIMAL COMPANION."
"Bonus HD: Extra eight-sided (d8) Hit Dice, each of which gains a Constitution modifier, as normal. Remember that extra Hit Dice improve the animal companion’s base attack and base save bonuses. An animal companion’s base attack bonus is the same as that of a druid of a level equal to the animal’s HD. An animal companion has good Fortitude and Reflex saves (treat it as a character whose level equals the animal’s HD). An animal companion gains additional skill points and feats for bonus HD as normal for advancing a monster’s Hit Dice."

It doesn't mention size, but it does mention gaining skills and feats "as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice."

Can someone post a link to the Andy Collins opinion?

-z

 

[youspoonybard]

Z, I'd love to. I was searching for it for a while.

It appears to have dropped off his boards. Not surprising, because I asked it a long time ago.

Sorry.

 

[jgsugden]

Z, I'd love to. I was searching for it for a while.

It appears to have dropped off his boards. Not surprising, because I asked it a long time ago.

Sorry.

It was on the WotC 3.5 discussion board (that is not archived) in the long set of questions that Andy answered.

 

[The Little Raven]

Animal companions are animals, not magical beasts. That was an error in the PHB.

Otherwise, all the druid's "animal" spells that used to work on his animal companion no longer do so.