Does Your Group Allow "Orb of Acid" As Written in Your Game

Do you use the Complete Arcane and the Orb of Acid spell?

  • Yes we use Complete Arcane and No the Orb of Acid spell is left as is

    Votes: 57 57.0%
  • Yes we use the Complete Arcane but we have changed the Orb of Acid spell

    Votes: 16 16.0%
  • Yes we use the Complete Arcane and Yes we have banned the spell outright

    Votes: 10 10.0%
  • No, we do not use the Complete Arcane and as such, we do not use the Orb of Acid spell

    Votes: 7 7.0%
  • Other (The poll does not allow me the full breadth of expression I have on this topic)

    Votes: 10 10.0%

Hello Everyone,

In short, as the title suggests. (This is my first poll so I hope I have not stuffed it up).

The long story however revolves around out most recent session. Our group as a whole is most probably pretty naive when it comes to internet discourse and game issues. I'm most probably the only one who regularly posts on an rpg site. As such, the full ramifications of the Orb of Acid spell struck the majority of the party full in the face last session.

What should have been the ultimate devestating encounter for the party was over so quickly, the DM blinked and all of a sudden we had beaten the final foe. It was a Demilich construct type thing (not exactly sure of the specs) that was immune to all magical effects - although it used it's own magic. One of the character's anti-magicked up and entered the space of the skull. Next comes my character Lucifus Cray with a quickened true strike followed by an Orb of Acid. For the next twenty minutes ensued some level of debate over whether the spell should a) be able to go through the anti-magic field (it was initiated outside of it) and b) that there was effectively no save and the fact that it bypassed so easily the spell immunity of the target. This then became a debate over whether the acid should be allowed to stay as an orb without magical assistance etc. etc. etc...

In the end, the rules were explicit: as an instantaneous creation effect, it threaded its way through all the bad boy's defences. A follow up Orb of Acid next round finished the thing off.
The anti-climax of it all left a bad taste in everyone's mouth. As such, I thought I'd try my first poll to see what EnWorld's perspective was on this spell.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise
 

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Herremann the Wise said:
In the end, the rules were explicit: as an instantaneous creation effect, it threaded its way through all the bad boy's defences. A follow up Orb of Acid next round finished the thing off.
The anti-climax of it all left a bad taste in everyone's mouth. As such, I thought I'd try my first poll to see what EnWorld's perspective was on this spell.

The problem isn't so much with the Orb of Acid (as such).

As noted by Jesse Decker last week, Anti-Magic Aura is a problem. Why does the Quickened True Strike work to hit the creature within the anti-magic aura?

There's a big problem with golem immunities in 3.5e as well. They're "immune to spells that allow spell resistance". However, what about the flaming sword? +1d6 fire damage... but that isn't affected by Spell Resistance. So, golems fall easy prey to flaming/frost/corrosive/shock weapons.

Cheers!
 

I allow limited use of spells outside core, as I consider them avalible by individual research.
so in practice this restricts any caster to a single orb spell, which must be won, or given as a favor, or learned through expensive research. So far only a single lesser orb has shown up.

- also I HR immune to magic, as stronger than RAW. no SR spells work against any SR, but not against immunity.
 

MerricB said:
The problem isn't so much with the Orb of Acid (as such).

As noted by Jesse Decker last week, Anti-Magic Aura is a problem. Why does the Quickened True Strike work to hit the creature within the anti-magic aura?
I don't have too much of a problem with this as the True Strike assists the wizard's ability to hit - not the targets ability to avoid. In general though, I would say Antimagic Field has a few issues as a 6th level spell.

MerricB said:
There's a big problem with golem immunities in 3.5e as well. They're "immune to spells that allow spell resistance". However, what about the flaming sword? +1d6 fire damage... but that isn't affected by Spell Resistance. So, golems fall easy prey to flaming/frost/corrosive/shock weapons.

Cheers!
Hmmm... I'm not too sure I agree with this. To me the golem immunities actually make sense (I know, I have problems ;)). If the thing causing the damage is non-magical, then it should affect a golem unless the golem has additional immunities to acid, fire etc. I would suggest the problem may be more to do with the sword in your example. The golem immunity ability seems to me to be a solid rule foundation.

However, Orb of Acid does a whopping 15d6 damage - compare that for potency to a flask of acid. I mean you simply can't buy acid that good. When you consider that a creature has three basic defences to avoid something like this (saving throw, spell resistance, touch AC) and the two toughest ones are bypassed by the spell, it makes for a highly unbalanced spell when it does so much damage (52.5 average). I think it's a nice rules niche for a spell but maybe, it should have been restricted to 10d6 max to keep it at least somewhat balanced. Alternatively, the duration should perhaps not be instantaneous.

In the end, I actually felt guilty using this spell. Now I can be a bit of a munchkin at times so that's a pretty big statement.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise
 

yeah, acid fog, melf's acid arrow, and acid splash all are nastier with the revision.

we took down a golem with a few well placed spells.
 

The orb spells are Evocations with Spell Resistance: yes.

Summon Monster spells are good spells to use that bypass SR. Use these Conjurations instead if that's what you want to do.
 

Herremann the Wise said:
This then became a debate over whether the acid should be allowed to stay as an orb without magical assistance etc. etc. etc...

In the end, the rules were explicit: as an instantaneous creation effect, it threaded its way through all the bad boy's defences. A follow up Orb of Acid next round finished the thing off.
The anti-climax of it all left a bad taste in everyone's mouth. As such, I thought I'd try my first poll to see what EnWorld's perspective was on this spell.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

Melf's Acid Arrow anyone? Should it be able to stay as an arrow without magic?

As it stands, I have no problem with the Orb of Acid being as it is. Ideally it should work more like Melf's or Vitriolic Sphere, but eh. Now Orb of Force, that one is stupid as it is, as are the other Orbs (I conjure Lightning!) In Living Greyhawk two of my friends play Wizards who use it, and they both joke that they collect their Orbs afterwards to sell.
 

Herremann the Wise said:
Hmmm... I'm not too sure I agree with this. To me the golem immunities actually make sense (I know, I have problems ;)). If the thing causing the damage is non-magical, then it should affect a golem unless the golem has additional immunities to acid, fire etc.

I'm trying to work out how a +1 flaming sword isn't doing magical fire damage, and I'm not succeeding too well. (Rules note: all the pre-reqs for flaming are affected by spell resistance; but the weapon special ability isn't).

Cheers!
 


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